Forum:P.S.: Difference between revisions
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:Chibnall's own admission is that this is a "scene that might have been". He says himself that it's ''not'' a DVD extra, it's not an alternative ending. It was a thing that ''might'' have been a DVD extra, had not actor availability interfered. We're seeing storyboards to something that didn't get filmed. It's not a valid source. Obviously, we can have a page about P.S., but it is ''not'' the valid continuation of Brian Williams' story, and it should not be used in the in-universe sections of articles. This scene '''did not''' occur between the Eleventh Doctor and Brian Williams. {{user:CzechOut/Sig}}{{User:CzechOut/TimeFormat}} 00:25: Tue 30 Oct 2012</span> | :Chibnall's own admission is that this is a "scene that might have been". He says himself that it's ''not'' a DVD extra, it's not an alternative ending. It was a thing that ''might'' have been a DVD extra, had not actor availability interfered. We're seeing storyboards to something that didn't get filmed. It's not a valid source. Obviously, we can have a page about P.S., but it is ''not'' the valid continuation of Brian Williams' story, and it should not be used in the in-universe sections of articles. This scene '''did not''' occur between the Eleventh Doctor and Brian Williams. {{user:CzechOut/Sig}}{{User:CzechOut/TimeFormat}} 00:25: Tue 30 Oct 2012</span> | ||
:I beg to differ. The scene was played out in the utmost seriousness. Rory's actor was recalled to do voice work. I think we should take this as just another webcast. It's really no diffrent from ''Shada'' or ''Real Time'' except for that it has captions. [[User:OttselSpy25|OS25]] ([[User Talk:OttselSpy25|talk to me, baby.]]) 01:17, October 30, 2012 (UTC) | :I beg to differ. The scene was played out in the utmost seriousness. Rory's actor was recalled to do voice work. I think we should take this as just another webcast. It's really no diffrent from ''Shada'' or ''Real Time'' except for that it has captions. [[User:OttselSpy25|OS25]] ([[User Talk:OttselSpy25|talk to me, baby.]]) 01:17, October 30, 2012 (UTC) | ||
::It's an open and shut case, unfortunately. Chibnall's Twitter remarks sink it. It was ''intended'' to be a DVD extra, but cancelled due to the actor's unavailability. Therefore, it's just an animated storyboard of a ''proposed'' scene. If it were ''always intended'' as an animated storyboard, that'd be one thing. But this is a released that's cobbled together from what remains. It's rather like all those extra scenes on either the season 3 or season 4 release that are introduced by RTD. They're all played "seriously". They were all potentially scenes that ''could'' have been. They're all "officially released". But they aren't part of the final narrative for various reasons. Same thing here. ''P.S.'' extends an official narrative. It ''could have been'' a DVD narrative. But it doesn't count because it was ''axed for cause''. It was intended as a filmed, live-action DVD extra. It ended up as an animated storyboard that was delivered over the internet, with the writer going out of his way to tell us that the project failed due to an actor's schedule. It's just an interesting "might have been", like any other deleted scene. {{user:CzechOut/Sig}}{{User:CzechOut/TimeFormat}} 04:38: Tue 30 Oct 2012</span> | |||
Revision as of 04:38, 30 October 2012
Index → Panopticon → P.S.
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User:Tybort has removed references to P.S. (webcast) from articles because it was an unshot scene, so it's not a valid source. However, given that the scene was later released as an animated webcast, I do think that it is a valid source as much as any live-action ones, since the animated webcast version is a narrative source. 78.8.5.21talk to me 12:52, October 12, 2012 (UTC)
- Agreed OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 22:06, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
The Beeb's stated purpose in producing and posting it was to respond to the fans' clammour for answers concerning whether the Doctor and/or River paid Brian a visit or if he was to never be given closure, and about to when Amy & Rory were sent. So, yes, it's clearly canon and thus not only valid, but of TV series-level validity/canon. – The preceding unsigned comment was added by OverAnalyser (talk • contribs) .
- The fact that the BBC have officially released a scene does not automatically make it a valid source under our policies. There are a number of scenes included on (classic) DVD releases which can't be considered valid. Officially showing us "what might have been" is not the same thing as showing us what was. For instance, we were officially shown the Eighth Doctor's regeneration in Endgame (graphic novel), but this site does not record that unpublished scene as the fact of Eight's regeneration.
- Tybort was quite right to sound a note of caution. We need to discuss further whether this is actually what happened or merely a scene that might have been. After all, it's known to have been written by Chibnall, and Chibnall wasn't the writer of the broadcast episode. It's another author's addendum to Moffat's work. That's problematic, in my view. We really do need to thrash out specifically why this thing should be counted as a valid source — not just let it go through "on the nod".
czechout<staff /> ☎ ✍ 04:33: Thu 25 Oct 2012
- It wasn't going to be an addendum to the episode, but was going to be released as a webcast/DVD extra epilogue, just like Pond Life is a prologue. If we count Pond Life and other webcasts, I don't see why we shouldn't count this one, even if it was realized in animated form instead of the one originally intended because of Brian's actor not being available. 78.8.96.10talk to me 22:54, October 25, 2012 (UTC)
- Got a source for any of these assertions?
czechout<staff /> ☎ ✍ 16:05: Sat 27 Oct 2012- here. It was meant to be a DVD extra, just like series 6's Night and the Doctor. 78.8.10.168talk to me 16:52, October 29, 2012 (UTC)
- Got a source for any of these assertions?
- It wasn't going to be an addendum to the episode, but was going to be released as a webcast/DVD extra epilogue, just like Pond Life is a prologue. If we count Pond Life and other webcasts, I don't see why we shouldn't count this one, even if it was realized in animated form instead of the one originally intended because of Brian's actor not being available. 78.8.96.10talk to me 22:54, October 25, 2012 (UTC)
- Chibnall's own admission is that this is a "scene that might have been". He says himself that it's not a DVD extra, it's not an alternative ending. It was a thing that might have been a DVD extra, had not actor availability interfered. We're seeing storyboards to something that didn't get filmed. It's not a valid source. Obviously, we can have a page about P.S., but it is not the valid continuation of Brian Williams' story, and it should not be used in the in-universe sections of articles. This scene did not occur between the Eleventh Doctor and Brian Williams.
czechout<staff /> ☎ ✍ 00:25: Tue 30 Oct 2012 - I beg to differ. The scene was played out in the utmost seriousness. Rory's actor was recalled to do voice work. I think we should take this as just another webcast. It's really no diffrent from Shada or Real Time except for that it has captions. OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 01:17, October 30, 2012 (UTC)
- It's an open and shut case, unfortunately. Chibnall's Twitter remarks sink it. It was intended to be a DVD extra, but cancelled due to the actor's unavailability. Therefore, it's just an animated storyboard of a proposed scene. If it were always intended as an animated storyboard, that'd be one thing. But this is a released that's cobbled together from what remains. It's rather like all those extra scenes on either the season 3 or season 4 release that are introduced by RTD. They're all played "seriously". They were all potentially scenes that could have been. They're all "officially released". But they aren't part of the final narrative for various reasons. Same thing here. P.S. extends an official narrative. It could have been a DVD narrative. But it doesn't count because it was axed for cause. It was intended as a filmed, live-action DVD extra. It ended up as an animated storyboard that was delivered over the internet, with the writer going out of his way to tell us that the project failed due to an actor's schedule. It's just an interesting "might have been", like any other deleted scene.
czechout<staff /> ☎ ✍ 04:38: Tue 30 Oct 2012
- It's an open and shut case, unfortunately. Chibnall's Twitter remarks sink it. It was intended to be a DVD extra, but cancelled due to the actor's unavailability. Therefore, it's just an animated storyboard of a proposed scene. If it were always intended as an animated storyboard, that'd be one thing. But this is a released that's cobbled together from what remains. It's rather like all those extra scenes on either the season 3 or season 4 release that are introduced by RTD. They're all played "seriously". They were all potentially scenes that could have been. They're all "officially released". But they aren't part of the final narrative for various reasons. Same thing here. P.S. extends an official narrative. It could have been a DVD narrative. But it doesn't count because it was axed for cause. It was intended as a filmed, live-action DVD extra. It ended up as an animated storyboard that was delivered over the internet, with the writer going out of his way to tell us that the project failed due to an actor's schedule. It's just an interesting "might have been", like any other deleted scene.
