Forum:Temporary forums/Changing the Spoiler Policy: Difference between revisions

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Updating links from Series 12 (Doctor Who) to Series 12 (Doctor Who 2005)

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-{{retitle|{{SUBPAGENAME}}}}{{spoiler}}
+{{retitle|{{SUBPAGENAME}}}}
-==Main discussion==
+{{archive}}[[Category:Policy changers|{{SUBPAGENAME}}]]
+{{spoiler}}
+{{big toc}}
+== Main discussion ==
 Right now, [[Tardis:Spoiler policy]] forbids any information about future releases from the wiki. The sole exception is series pages, where anything goes. But this approach is unworkably out of date for a few reasons:
 * For almost a year, the top trending search on this wiki was [REDACTED], an actor who we still don't even have a page for! By catering to extreme spoilerphobes, we're failing a vast majority of our users, who ''do'' want to read about future cast and crew on the wiki.
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 ::::: [https://tardis.fandom.com/wiki/Tardis:Where_spoilers_are_allowed?type=revision&diff=3290656&oldid=2819371 Oh never mind]. {{User:Epsilon the Eternal/signature}} 18:33, 25 January 2023 (UTC)
-[[Category:Temporary forums]]
 I agree with the proposal, and I agree it's rather mad we don't have pages for [him] and [her] - they've been announced, we even have photos (and video) of them in costume. People will be searching for information, even said information is sparse. We have a page for [[Series 14 (Doctor Who)|Series 14]], which is in production, (''and ''a page for Series 15!) so why not for the 2 leading actors starring in it? [[User:FractalDoctor|FractalDoctor]] [[User talk:FractalDoctor|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 18:54, 25 January 2023 (UTC)
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 :I'm also unconvinced about DWM spoilers. These are nowhere near as publicized as the "press release" style announcements and it's far from clear to me that the average fan is ''expected'' to know what's being said in DWM, while they're certainly ''expected'' to know about the four major [REDACTED]s, as well as some of the minor [REDACTED]s. While we can't see the more recent spoiler discussions, I note that Czech brought up a similar point in [https://tardis.fandom.com/wiki/Forum:Proposed_change_to_spoiler_policy 2011] with no clear resolution.
-:Something not discussed is spoilers on forums. This is, quite frankly, imperative to our work, and it's stunning to me that people haven't discussed this yet. We will forever be playing a game of catch-up unless we can discuss stories and eras ''before'' they come out and can plan for them. Part of our discussion in [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Slot 3: Updating the main page & theme]] has stalled out because we simply cannot discuss ''updating the theme further'' without a reconsideration of our spoiler policy! (Do we update our theme for the thing happening in November now? If so, we need to discuss specifics on how to do so. Both things require tweaks to our spoiler policy. I think this is a '''''really important''''' question to answer!) Lest you think this is an isolated incident, let me assure you it is not. [[Can I Help You? (short story)|Can I Help You?]] was announced ''prior'' to our forums going down, and I asked an admin if I should make a thread about it at that time, since it had implications for our merchandising rules. I was told that if it was ruled to be a (valid) story in that thread we would have been retroactively been violating our spoiler rules the entire time. As a result it was put off, and here we stand, two years later. [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 19:10, 25 January 2023 (UTC)
+:Something not discussed is spoilers on forums. This is, quite frankly, imperative to our work, and it's stunning to me that people haven't discussed this yet. We will forever be playing a game of catch-up unless we can discuss stories and eras ''before'' they come out and can plan for them. Part of our discussion in [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Archive/Updating the main page & theme]] has stalled out because we simply cannot discuss ''updating the theme further'' without a reconsideration of our spoiler policy! (Do we update our theme for the thing happening in November now? If so, we need to discuss specifics on how to do so. Both things require tweaks to our spoiler policy. I think this is a '''''really important''''' question to answer!) Lest you think this is an isolated incident, let me assure you it is not. [[Can I Help You? (short story)|Can I Help You?]] was announced ''prior'' to our forums going down, and I asked an admin if I should make a thread about it at that time, since it had implications for our merchandising rules. I was told that if it was ruled to be a (valid) story in that thread we would have been retroactively been violating our spoiler rules the entire time. As a result it was put off, and here we stand, two years later. [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 19:10, 25 January 2023 (UTC)
 ::: Wup-up-up. Setting aside any wider changes, '''these "REDACTED"s are getting silly.''' I have half a mind to declare that, whatever other changes we may or may not create consensus around, '''this specific Forum thread might be exempt from normal T:SPOIL rules under the same terms as a series page with a banner, so that we can, you know, actually know what we're talking about'''. Does anyone here disagree with this?
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 :I again note that nobody has actually argued for a refocusing of the rules on the spoilerphile, (bullet points 1-3 do not do this), and that this is not a black and white dichotomy. I don't think it unreasonable to suspect that there are US fans who keep up with BBC press releases but have little interest in DWM. Those of us who edit the wiki are the minority. [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 18:42, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
-::You keep saying or implying that [[T:SPOIL]] barred the Timeless Child leaks from being posted on [[Series 12 (Doctor Who)]], but I quoted [[T:RUMOR]] and it doesn't say anything of the sort. Anyone could have cited an r/Gallifrey thread and put it in the rumours section of [[Series 12 (Doctor Who)]]. – [[User:NateBumber|n8]] ([[User talk:NateBumber|☎]]) 19:15, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
+::You keep saying or implying that [[T:SPOIL]] barred the Timeless Child leaks from being posted on [[Series 12 (Doctor Who 2005)]], but I quoted [[T:RUMOR]] and it doesn't say anything of the sort. Anyone could have cited an r/Gallifrey thread and put it in the rumours section of [[Series 12 (Doctor Who 2005)]]. – [[User:NateBumber|n8]] ([[User talk:NateBumber|☎]]) 19:15, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
 :: Najawin, I’d suspect people who are unbothered by BBC press releases and keep up with them, but ''are'' somehow bothered by tidbits from DWM, are themselves a pretty tiny minority. And the existence of a vaguely worded spoiler warning is surely better than no spoiler warning? Just because the rules might change, doesn’t mean the wiki will suddenly devolve into a cesspit of chaos. You can have faith that effort will be put in, to make sure the new system works. I’d argue that if there are ‘kinks’, you can’t iron them out of existence pre-emptively, and succumb to analysis paralysis : you actually have to let the process run its course, and then make tweaks along the way if necessary. [[User:TheGreatGabester|TheGreatGabester]] [[User talk:TheGreatGabester|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 19:22, 27 January 2023 (UTC)
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 (I'd also suggest that we should update our main page to a theme for the 60th specials sooner rather than later, but that might require its own heading. Technically as my specific idea would have a picture of Tate it would be a spoiler, otherwise it's not really something we need to discuss until we worry about getting ahead of S14.) [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 23:53, 29 January 2023 (UTC)
-:As for the main page thing, we already have that discussion ongoing at [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Slot 3: Updating the main page & theme]]. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 00:02, 30 January 2023 (UTC)
+:As for the main page thing, we already have that discussion ongoing at [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Archive/Updating the main page & theme]]. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 00:02, 30 January 2023 (UTC)
 ::The only reason we couldn’t finish the discussion on the 27th was because of the damn spoiler policy. As soon as the spoiler issue is out of the way, we can get back to finishing up discussions for that one. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 00:08, 30 January 2023 (UTC)
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 :I forgot to mention it but I am strongly in favor that, being able to rework the main page to match an upcoming era of the show [[User:Time God Eon|Time God Eon]] [[User talk:Time God Eon|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 12:56, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
-::As Najawin said… we are nearing the deadline of this thread, which currently means we have today plus 2 days more until this entire thread has to be resolved and closed. Unless we give it 3 more weeks to run. Which in turn means that we have to also add 3 more weeks to [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Slot 3: Updating the main page & theme]] again, which by the way is also about to run out of time again. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
+::As Najawin said… we are nearing the deadline of this thread, which currently means we have today plus 2 days more until this entire thread has to be resolved and closed. Unless we give it 3 more weeks to run. Which in turn means that we have to also add 3 more weeks to [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Archive/Updating the main page & theme]] again, which by the way is also about to run out of time again. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
 :::: I am in fact gearing up to close this on time! But yes, by all means keep discussing the main page thing (and any other salient points) until then. That being said, it ''is'' perfectly normal for a thread with such a broad scope as this one to offer a partial closure to some of the main points, while pushing off particular points of contention to their own threads. That's what we did with the subpage policy thread, for example, and what I did in my closing post of the tabbed-galleries thread. I'm not convinced we'll need to for the main page thing, but it'd be a perfectly normal thing to do. [[User:Scrooge MacDuck|'''Scrooge MacDuck''']] [[User_talk:Scrooge MacDuck|⊕]] 13:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
-I'm well aware, which is why I am actively imploring people to discuss this issue before the deadline so it's not just me shouting into the void that this should happen. (Indeed, if it ''doesn't'' happen, our extension of [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Slot 3: Updating the main page & theme]] will be completely for nothing, since that was extended ''in large part to have this discussion''.) Please, discuss, even if you just want to say "agree" or "disagree". In order for the precise redesign to the main page to be decided on, we need to pin down this policy. [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:47, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
+I'm well aware, which is why I am actively imploring people to discuss this issue before the deadline so it's not just me shouting into the void that this should happen. (Indeed, if it ''doesn't'' happen, our extension of [[Tardis:Temporary forums/Archive/Updating the main page & theme]] will be completely for nothing, since that was extended ''in large part to have this discussion''.) Please, discuss, even if you just want to say "agree" or "disagree". In order for the precise redesign to the main page to be decided on, we need to pin down this policy. [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:47, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
 : I agree with having the main page updated to reflect the incoming era. I would also like to note that I am strongly considering giving the main page thread another extension as it's not really a traditional policy thread and could definetly benefit from more time (other than issues with spoilers, I know that I have many ideas that I haven't yet had time to actually try drafting up and others may feel the same). [[User:Bongolium500|<span title="aka Bongolium500">Bongo50</span>]] [[User talk:Bongolium500|<span title="talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:45, 12 February 2023 (UTC)