More actions
Please abide by our discussion policy and be nice to other editors in this discussion. Remember: this talk page is only for discussing the editing of the attached article. Take speculation to The Howling, our general discussion forum. Messages not having to do with the improvement of the article may be deleted.
Episode Length
A press release has confirmed that the episode will last 55 minutes from 6:05-7:00
The Dream Lord
The Dream Lord was just the "bad side" of the doctor, if you remember, so the rumour doesn't make ANY sense.
For now and unmessyness
Until it confirmed and the episode airs it is hard to determine which aliens who are appearing will be a villain/enemy so I have placed all confirmed appearances of previous aliens in the story notes section until it is actually confirmed who will be the villains as it helps to stop people messing with the infobox. -- Michael Downey 11:54, May 22, 2010 (UTC).
Omega and Dark Tower/Death Zone
See Talk:The Pandorica Opens. Whatever is done with these rumors, let's make sure that the two pages are kept in sync. --Falcotron 07:26, May 23, 2010 (UTC)
Its not Omega, it is 'The Monk', who is responsible for Stonehenge and its consrtuction. Listen to the voice again, the one which repeates 'Silence will Fall' numersously in the TARDIS, when River has no control======Sontar HA========
Monster Names
I've fixed up all the aliens confirmed to appear on the "enemy" bit on the infobox. If you have any other names of monsters please put them down along with a reference. ~ BillyWilliam3rd
Rory
Why did someone remove Rory from the cast? We know he's appearing. Weren't there even pictures of him in it? He may have died, but still: wibbly wobbly timey wimey. --Golden Monkey 20:35, May 29, 2010 (UTC)
I bet there is evidence that Rory is gonna appear (not that I took him off cast) but wherez the evidence? ~ BillyWilliam3rd
- I'm not sure who removed him here. I added him, with a reference, at the same time I removed him from episode 12 (because all of the spoilery evidence given for him was from episode 13, not 12).
- However, thinking about it some more, we don't actually have confirmation (at least in any of the spoilers I've seen) that Rory appears in episode 13. There are pictures confirming that Arthur Darvill appears, in Roman armor (one source specifically says Roman auxiliary armor), but that doesn't prove that he's Rory. Sure, it seems the most likely explanation, but think of Princess Astra and Romana II, Maxil and the 6th Doctor, Gwynneth and Gwen, Adeola and Martha, the Soothsayer and Amy Pond, and probably more that I've forgotten. In many cases, there's a connection of some kind between the characters (Romana deliberately patterning herself on Astra, Martha having a Patty-Duke-like identical cousin, Gwen having a not-genetic-relative-but-some-weird-rifty-thing, etc.), but in some there's not even that.
- Still, it seems reasonable to at the very least least add Arthur Darvill to the Cast playing "TBA (possibly Rory Williams)", with the same reference that he had before, and then put some discussion of whether he's Rory or not in the Rumours section.
- Alternatively, I'd list him as Rory, and then add a Rumour that he might be some character other than Rory. After all, it's always possible that even the 11th Doctor won't be there and Matt Smith will just happen to be playing some random character. How far do we have to go with our skepticism? --Falcotron 10:44, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
Shots of filming
Without trying to throw out spoilers, a couple of leaked filming shots snuck out today on a few websites show Patrick Stewart's presence clearly on the set for this episode...what's the policy of posting in regards to such matters? Are we a) not allowed to mention, b) allowed to mention and source c) post the images proper and mention. Ostensibly, I'll do whatever the guidance is....unless someone sees the shots before me and gets there first! Roger Dangerfield 11:23, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
- There's already a big giant spoiler warning at the top of the page, and the article is already full of spoilers and even random rumours. So, don't worry about adding it. And definitely source it.
- The only question is how reliable the source is, and how clear it is that Patrick Stewart is in the episode vs., say, just visiting the set. Make the best guess you can on those questions and decide whether to put it in Rumours or to add him to the Cast. --Falcotron 11:55, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
- One more question: Does he look like he's dressed as the Meddling Monk? (Remember that Sun rumor that Stewart would play the Monk in the finale of David Tennant's season 5, which came out days before it was announced that no such season would exist?) --Falcotron 22:39, May 30, 2010 (UTC)
Theory
I think that Amy, as a child, may have to "think away" the other aliens etc, and the Doctor free, as the summary says "The only hope for all of reality is a little girl....", however, this is only my theory. :P Because the alliance used Amy's memories of Romans and Pandora's Box to create the scenario, therefore, if Amy thinks of a different ending... It'll happen. :P ~Random non-member, came to add my thoughts. ^^
dr gachet
is this an error becuse dr gachet is vincent van goths docter isent he so unless the doc goes back to ask about the painting that vincent did this colud be a error (now i am starting to make myself belvie this happens)
?Drwhoworld 22:14, June 3, 2010 (UTC)?
No, Dr Gachet and Madam Vernet must have something to do with the VG picture being sent to the doctor? 86.26.137.154 08:33, June 4, 2010 (UTC)
Thanks
?Drwhoworld 09:19, June 4, 2010 (UTC)?
Doctor Gachet and Madame Vernet were seen at the very start of The Pandorica Opens when Van Gogh was screaming
DBuddy 18:57, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
Flesh & Stone
Remember the Doctor going to Amy in Flesh and Stone and he looked diffrent? New clothes, difrent attidue, etc? Possibly going back to the events of this story and giving Amy words of advice for this episode.
Jfraser25 13:00, June 6, 2010 (UTC)
I am really annoyed that they have no Weeping Angels in it,because they are my faverioute enemy!!!:( OGREPOP 09:36, June 13, 2010 (UTC)
Something no one noticed but was shown in The Lodger: head-butt! Remember, he bumped heads and communicated a lot of info real fast? Just looked at the scene in Flesh & Stone and the Doctor gently bumps his head several times to Amy's and tells her to remember. I think he passed her a lot of information to help him be remembered by Amy. Lmb02 05:05, June 19, 2010 (UTC)
Picture
The picture in this article is not to do with The Big Bang. It is of The Pandorica Opens. I just saw the same scene image only a side view on the website. Kranitoko (talk) 17:22, June 11, 2010 (UTC)
Let's keep rumours clean.
It's flood with random fan speculation that isn't based on anything, or very little. Or far-ferfetched. The only heavily rumoured ultimate enemy of the finale are the Doctor and Omega, and that is based on quite a bit of released into and spoilers, so it has a right to be an official rumour on the page. The description of what is inside the Pandorica fits the description of the Doctor... and he is shown being dragged to the Pandorica in a released picture most have seen by now. There has been a opular rumour that Omega in returning, too, and some reliable spoiler people on Gallifrey Base (these are people who, in all honestly, know quite a way ahead, some see unreleased pictures earlier on, ect..) may not know if the rumour is true or not, but they mostly say it is possibly -- nothing even they know suggests it can't be.
But ridiculous things such as the Master, who left in, what, January and the very last finale... already? Besides, that's one of those silly random fan-boy-fueled rumours that aren't based on anything, be it set reports, spoilers, or episode information. Let's keep it at individuals who are heavily rumoured, and not just fanboy wants. Delton Menace 22:44, June 13, 2010 (UTC)
Yes this is similair to the enemy section. I have repeatedly kept it as "TBC" as even though there are many aliens/monsters mentioned and confirmed to appear, nothing is confirmed whether they are to play an enemy part so until Saturday or proper confirmation this should be kept clean. -- Michael Downey 23:50, June 13, 2010 (UTC).
Yeah, it should be noted that some of the aliens featured in the finale don't have large roles (there are too many for them all to have notable roles!), just that there is appearances. All together, gathering at Stonehenge. An interview I found linked to on a Gallifrey Base friend even notes that the Daleks and Cybermen aren't even big players in the finale, or something like that. They play a part, obviously, but they're not the shine of the episodes. Their role is just bigger than that of the other's. Good you kept the enemies part clean, because... info is really implying it's not everyone vs. the Doctor. Well, sort of. But it is safe to say something else is going on, and none of us have any idea what it really is. Hence, I'm expecting one, true enemy, who is currently not confirmed. Delton Menace 01:09, June 14, 2010 (UTC)
Theres a typo error in the rummors section. They will might appear? It should be they will/might appear K-9 mark 5 19:06, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
Moffat's "cheeky" Regeneration solution?
Moffat was quoted as saying he was going to solve the problem of the Doctor running out of regenerations in a "cheeky" way. And from what I understood, it would be in this series. And with this being the last part of this series, I would guess it gets solved in this episode. And likely by (we presume it's) Amelia thinking a change of some sort (as it seems Amy's childhood and thoughts are the building blocks of the reality... this better not end like "St. Elsewhere" did, where the whole show was an autistic kid's dream)..
Just wondering if anyone has heard any more on what the "cheeky" solution is. I'm hoping it's not by saying one or more regenerations never happened. Still, it's an impending problem for the show, and better to solve it now than wait until they've run out of regenerations and require an even greater suspension of disbelief than fans would allow.
Posting here rather than the actual page, assuming if it's appropriate someone will either migrate this to the actual page or suggest I do so. Lmb02 04:27, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
I would imagine that a nice "cheeky" way would be simply to have whoever the mysterious voice way -- hopefully a time lord say a nice one-liner about how "Gallifrey and Rassilon are gone, so those rules never apply", and then writeing it off. Incredebly short and simple, as well as plausible.
Stone Dalek
- A new Dalek will be seen, a Stone Dalek. Or, less absurdly, a Dalek will be turned to stone.
How is that any "less absurd"? A Dalek with a stone casing, though really unusual, makes much more sense than a Dalek turned into stone, unless you refer to the creature inside instead of the machine. Where does that rumour come from anyway and why is it not in the "rumours" section? 83.181.66.133 10:04, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
A picture of a stone Dalek was released, along with several other leaked photos, about a week ago (DoctorWhoTV has the pics). The Nth Doctor 20:54, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
Another Tardis?
I think that there is another contraption similar to the one we have seen in the episode of "The Lodger" in Amy's house. As can be seen in both "The Pandorica Opens" and "The Eleventh Hour", Amy's house is a two stores home, yet, in the first episode of this series, around the 13 minutes mark ("there's something I'm missing" - he keeps repeating that alot lately, hasn't he?), and especially around the 18 minutes mark (in which there's a clear lower angle shot) there's a staircase from the second floor to an unknown, rather dark, place. WhtRvn 10:26, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
- (in reply to the above comment) You are really on to something here, he says to Amy 'doesn't it bother you that your life does not make sense?' (The Pandorica Opens) and then keeps reiterating about why she has so many rooms in her house, remember, when she was little she was on her own, when she is older, again, she is on her own. Possibly, and this is a rumour (although it is founded on evidence found throughout the series, and built on the above comment) she has always been on 'her own', she may have never had parents or family but she just beleived she did, because she cannot remember her past e.g. like the Doctor with the 'family of blood' and the Master in 'Utopia' via the 'fobwatch'. Thus, this 'house' which seems so important, and has been 'broken into' could well hold a 'tardis' within, such as is seen in the Lodger. It may well be just a bungalo, like every other in 'Ledworth' and the 'top floor' is just a 'Tardis' with undoubtedly functional 'chameleon circuit'. However, all this is theory (I beleive it to be true) but could well explain why Joanne Page is reported to be in the 'Big Bang', could she be a 'regenerated' Amy Pond? If so, this begs the question, who is she? Is she going to be a new charachter (possibly the Ha'Rik?!), or an already known timelady, such as well Romanna, the Rani, or even the unknown timelady in the 'End of Time'. It would also explan why River Song acted so coy to Amy Pond and also why she said she learnt how to fly the TARDIS from the 'best' and also added (in reply to the Doctor) 'shame you were not around that day'. Again this is just theory, but seeing as this is a 'DISCUSSION' page i thought i would throw it out there, please do not attack me, but if anyone wants to comment or reply on this, please do =====- 'Sontar HA'=====
- Unfortunately, Joanna Page has denied being in the episode. 79.72.221.114 21:00, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Also, in "The Pandorica Opens" River Song admits that she, in fact, did learn to fly the Tardis from the Doctor.
(in response to the above) Well, I only used the Joanna Page because it was rumoured, but the presidence still stands, she could well be a timelord or at least an entity not human. Fair enough, I must have missed that, but still it makes little difference to the overall 'rumour' I had written about====Sontar HA======
You also Have to remember that There is actuallya possible three doctors out there. With three doctors out there... It is likely that A Tardis could be pulled from one to server The needing Doctor for a short time..... Seen here in the Continuity section for The Gallifrey Chronicles Ominic 14:06, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
(responding to the first and second comment) In 'The Eleventh Hour'
- 09:33 - while Amy is talking about apples and the Doctor turns around to listen an unusual drawing on the wall is revealed. Its a drawing of a house on fire. Why would a child draw this? unless it actually happened to them it could possibly be a clue to how Amy became an orphan.
- 18:25 - While Amy "arrests" the doctor for breaking and entering. This shot (from the doctors point of view) shows a staircase that leads straight up to the ceiling with absolutely no sign of a door or a hatch. Anyone would notice this and think it strange. but the doctor doesn't notice it instead paying attention only to Amy. (perception filter?)
- Yes. I've already pointed that out in the first comment. Nice finding of the 9:33 mark, the drawing does seem a bit odd. WhtRvn 10:00, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
Addition to casting
I can't edit this page because I'm an IP, but can someone add this to the cast? Joanna Page is listed as playing a Time Lady in both The Pandorica Opens and The Big Bang. --94.171.77.82 11:43, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
- I have incorporated it into the article. Although she's denied appearing in the episode, it wouldn't be the first time she's misrepresented to the press to cover up storylines. I've written it in a way where it is open to interpretation whether she's in it or not, from the available sources. Blightsoot 12:11, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
- Imdb is user written, just as the wiki and is not a reliable source. The Thirteenth Doctor 14:47, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
- IMDB is to some extent user written, but not nearly to the extent wikipedia is - it has at least got some level of editorial responsibility for such articles. That and this has been reported as a rumour in a news paper. The rest haven't so much as got a source at all. Therefore it is justified to put it in there - if we didn't have IMDB as a source, then many of the things posted in future episode articles all season would have to be removed. I'm restoring the rumour as per sources available. Blightsoot 11:26, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
Unknown Entity
- As we all know, the TARDIS goes boom at the end of 'The Pandorica Opens'/start of 'The Big Bang' when controlled by an entity so far unknown while River Song is desperately attempting to prevent this incident. All we know about this entity is that it appears so far as red lighting and a metallic voice claiming that silence will fall coming from a time-field shaped crack displayed on the TARDIS' screen. The entity seems to enter and gain control of the TARDIS when nobody is watching in 'The Pandorica Opens' when the crack appears, flashes and starts to open on the screen, however, there is evidence to suggest the TARDIS has been out of the Doctor's control for a much longer time, this whole series in fact. If the entity has been inside the TARDIS since the doctor took Amy for her first trip, the Entity either entered the TARDIS shortly after the machine restabilised, is an evil streak in TARDIS' personality (like Mr. Smith from SJA) or has been dorment inside the TARDIS for a long time. SinkinSoon 13:02, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
- A trace left behind from when the Master cannibilised the TARDIS, turning her into a Paradox machine?
- "The Doctor in the TARDIS" merged i nthe regeneration. Arn't you supposed to be on the howling with us for all of this speculation? Jack Chilli.
Silurians?
So, the Silurians feature in this episode, and we've seen many of the Doctor's friends unite to send him a message... Except Eldane, who seems wise and on the Doctors side. It's possible that the Silurians returned to the surface of Earth as instructed and found the scorched ruined planet left behind by humanity (See: The Beast Below) and decided to join this evil alliance, so... If Eldane is still around, the Doctor may yet have friends he can count on. Thoughts? WeepingDevil 14:53, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
It does seem rather strange that the Silurians should join in the 'Grand Alliance' along with other notable enemies such as the Daleks, Cybermen and Sontarans. As we are well aware, the Silurians intentions are not as wicked as those of say the Daleks or the Cybermen, they are generally mis-understood if anything. I can see what you are suggesting, and although it WOULD make sense I just do not think it will be relevant to the plot-line. In fact, the whole 'alliance' is the only problem i have with the Pandorica Opens, for one, we do not (yet) know what Cybermen these are, after all, they DO look like Cybusmen, yet they seem a greater threat and the fact they have 'starships' makes little sense, especially if they ARE Cybusmen, because, how would they have the technology to build starships and what need would they have for them , never mind how they got from the parallel to our dimension. Then there are the Silurians, what need would they have to disable the Doctor, unless, they are double-bluffing? Then there are the Judoon, who if I am not mistaken are supposed to be the heavies employed by the Shadow Proclamation, who I do not thiink would ever take side with the Daleks, surely?! Therefore, i think there are real plot holes at present in this finale, especially where the 'enemies' are concerned, and it all seems a little fan-boy to me. - Sontar HA
I don't know about you, but if I learned that this ancient, powerful man who rides throughout all of time and space at will was at the centre of an explosion that would destroy all of reality, I'd team up with anyone in the universe I had to in order to prevent that. An alliance based on a single goal is far different from a permanent military alliance. The united just for this one moment, and afterwards will go their separate ways. 124.254.80.117 20:39, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
Question about the episode
Do we have any idea why the TARDIS (or the entity controlling it) has decided to take River Song to Amy's time? It was almost like helping the Doctor, taking River to a place that revealed to her the true nature of what was going on with the Alliance. If the entity simply wants to destroy the universe by blowing up the TARDIS, why give The Doctor that slight warning of what is happening? Any theories as to why it needs or wants to go there? WeepingDevil 14:53, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
My theory is that as i said before 'Amy's house' is in fact a hidden TARDIS. Now, I cannot be sure as to why this (beleived to be) sinister TimeLord wants to take River to the TARDIS or at least to Amy's room to show her its master plan, unless, there is a more present danger other than that of the 'alliance'. Could there be an enemy who is (like a puppet-master) bended everyone around to its will, making plans within plans to get everyone to do as it wants? I am aware how far fetched this sounds but I really think someone such as the Master, Rassilon, the Monk or Omega are behind this. Remember, 'the Monk' is responsible for creating Stonehenge (sorry forgot the reference-look up the Monk anyway). Could Moffat really be making a finale here based on plot details from near 20-30 years ago?! I would certainly not put it past him!!78.148.145.194 17:54, June 20, 2010 (UTC)Sontar HA78.148.145.194 17:54, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
The article cites citation #9 (lifetheuniverseandcombom blog) as the source for Karen Westwood as Amy Pond's mother. However, that blog itself cites imdb and tardis.wikia's own article as its sources. IMDB's page does include Karen Westwood, so citing IMDB would make sense. However, citing an article that cites your own article as its source for the same information...well I think it goes without saying that that's silly and fine for Dr. Who but not for a wiki. 72.93.185.63 22:05, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
House door
Random thoughts here, but...
Did anyone ever notice the similarity between the entry door to Amy's house and the Doctor's actual TARDIS? Same blue, same material (wood), and it looks like it's tacked on another house? Minor detail, to be sure, but I find it rather odd... Don't you?
Cybikbase 22:44, June 20, 2010 (UTC)
Just to say this
I think that AMELIA Pond will open The Pandorica in 1996 or near there when she see's it (seen in a picture on The Pandorica Opens page a few days ago) and the Doctor will escape that would explain The Doctor in this episode after he was locked in the biggest badest prison ever? Hennessehh 00:11, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
Cluttersome 'rumours'
Can someone please remove the 'Blind Fury' concept art and the associated ridiculously left-field suggestion that Gallifrey will return? There is no evidence that the art has anything to do with this episode. In fact, there is more evidence that the art is early development of the Krafayis from "Vincent and the Doctor". It may turn out that it is relevant to this episode, but there is currently no basis to even call it a 'rumour'.
Also, will someone please remove the rumour relating to the 'Timoreen, Skarkish and Ha'rik"? This rumour has been on EVERY episode page of the new series for a while now and has been consistently found false. The argument is that they've been stated to make an appearance in this series and haven't so far, so they must be appearing now. Well, here's an alternative - not all publicity put out about Doctor Who is true, and, if people hadn't realised, the Christmas Special is yet to come. It's just clutter that someone keeps rolling over everytime an episode airs.
Finally, will everyone stop discussing their latest nut-job theory on this discussion page? This is a page for discussing edits to the article. Please save your mindless chatter for a mindless forum somewhere.
202.14.81.49 10:01, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
Amy's House
Does anyone else notice the fact that Amy's house has three sets of stairs...and yet it's only two stories tall. Either she has an attic, and a fancy way of reaching it...or it's bigger on the inside. Is this a continuity error? 99.186.23.194 10:43, June 21, 2010 (UTC) Kieren
thats a very good point. maybe its theres a perception filter around the staris next to her room and it keps a TARDIS? Ooiue 15:48, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
Blind Fury?
Anyone have any ideas on the "Blind Fury" concept art image (see rumors section)? It's being used at some point in series 5 (according to the web site it came from), so it presumably has to appear in ep 13, it's got a picture of the Citadel of the Time Lords on the front, it references the "Sons of Gallifrey"...what is it? A book cover of some sort? Why no author's name, then? And what's with the arrow pointing between two stars? Bluebox444 23:51, June 21, 2010 (UTC)
It was originally going to appear in Vincent and the Doctor, but it was cut. This is the perfect example of a typical fanboy wanting wanwank, and making connections that aren't there for the finale. Delton Menace 12:05, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
The War Chief?
Phillip Madoc seems to be credited in this episode, so is it possible that the War Chief is behind all this?
He was responsible for pulling humans out of time before in The War Games, he could be reason all these enemies are present in 102AD as opposed to their own time periods (Silurians, Daleks, and Cybermen certainly shouldn't be there)
It might have also been his voice we heard in the Tardis saying 'Silence will fall'