Please DO NOT add to this discussion.
I've been thinking about this for a while(since The series 7 finale actually) and wanted to lay things out as to what I think and hear if I'm just going crazy or not.
With Regards to John Hurt~
He's almost definitely between 8 and Nine. The clothing, the fact that basically every other doctor has regenerated onscreen(understanding 2-->3 to be the exception here, but I don't see the classical doctors havingthe kind of traumatic response to this or Moffat having a way to wing it in there without some kind of extreme gimmick.) It's more a question of "what happened with him" that makes him a mystery. I don't think it was the time war itself, as the new series doctors have generally acknowledged it and came to terms with it. Which brings up some other traumatic moment in the Doctor's history that we (as of yet) don't know anything about? I recall Nine saying to Rose 'I was born out of anger and rage", or something a long those lines.
With regards to the events of the fiftieth~
It's been confirmed that both the Daleks and the Zygons will be present in the anniversary. Considering that the 50th takes place within the docs time stream, I'm wondering why the Zygons of all monsters are getting this 'place of honor", so to speak.
More to come, but food for thought and such.
--Orboknown ☎ 19:08, July 22, 2013 (UTC)
I'm wondering if Hurt might actually be Doctor 8.5. After all, the Watcher was technically 4.5 (I think, not sure if that was really explained), and the Valeyard was Doctor 12.5, so my theory is that during the Time War, the 8th Doctor was blocked from regeneration. He was dying and merged with someone (John Hurt) because he was prevented from regenerating. This theory is possible. Its happened before. Remember the master merging with Nyssa's father. He would be 8.5 but not the "real" 9th incarnation.– The preceding unsigned comment was added by 92.15.150.62 (talk).
I wasn't aware that time lords could "Merge" with other beings. That actually brings up a huge realm of possibilities, and could be responsible for the apparent change in thought-process/mindset with regards to the Hurt Doctor, as indicated by the "what I did..." line that 11 seemed so opposed to.
Orboknown ☎ 22:30, July 22, 2013 (UTC)
92, please sign your posts. It's very hard for others to read a "conversation" when there are unsigned posts. Shambala108 ☎ 00:42, July 23, 2013 (UTC)
Things I wish everyone understood:
1) Doctor 2 was seen regenerating into Doctor 3, but not onscreen; it was in a black-and-white comic series, the particular "regeneration" volume of which (if not the whole thing) was released between The War Games and Spearhead from Space. After working for the Celestial Intervention Agency for a while, including (allegedly) his involvement in several multi-Doctor specials, 2 was chased by living scarecrows into the TARDIS, where a Time Lord representative finally carried out the sentence and forced him to regenerate (but not nearly as simple as that).
2) The Watcher wasn't necessarily 4.5, he was 4...or 5...okay, not helping. The Watcher is what Time Lords can do; project an image of their next incarnation that can walk and talk like an independent entity, but that fuses back into them at the time they regenerate. A Time Lord in Planet of the Spiders did so far better (or so I've read on this wiki), making his projection look exactly like his next self, while the Doctor was far less experienced and, the only time he tried it, his projection just looked like a white-clad mummy. —BioniclesaurKing4t2 - "Hello, I'm the Doctor. Basically, . . . run." 00:53, July 23, 2013 (UTC)
That might have actually been my fault when I responded to 92 shambala. I saw who responded when I went to answer back. I'm new to wiki's so yea.
"1) Doctor 2 was seen regenerating into Doctor 3, but not onscreen; it was in a black-and-white comic series, the particular "regeneration" volume of which (if not the whole thing) was released between The War Games and Spearhead from Space. After working for the Celestial Intervention Agency for a while, including (allegedly) his involvement in several multi-Doctor specials, 2 was chased by living scarecrows into the TARDIS, where a Time Lord representative finally carried out the sentence and forced him to regenerate (but not nearly as simple as that).
"
Thanks for that. That(assuming it's canon, which I don't see why you'd be referencing it if it wasn't) that leaves the only unaccounted regeneration as 8-9.
" 2) The Watcher wasn't necessarily 4.5, he was 4...or 5...okay, not helping. The Watcher is what Time Lords can do; project an image of their next incarnation that can walk and talk like an independent entity, but that fuses back into them at the time they regenerate. A Time Lord in Planet of the Spiders did so far better (or so I've read on this wiki), making his projection look exactly like his next self, while the Doctor was far less experienced and, the only time he tried it, his projection just looked like a white-clad mummy. —" That's..interesting, But I suppose that's a whole nother topic.--Orboknown ☎ 14:12, July 23, 2013 (UTC)
Orbknown (first post): I think the Zygons are in because of David Tennant. I remember him saying they were his favourite enemies and Ten never met them in the show so who knows, maybe the Zygons were a way of encouraging him to come back? 87.102.91.126talk to me 20:27, August 8, 2013 (UTC)
"I wasn't aware that time lords could "Merge" with other beings." - normally they can't. The Master could only do that because he had some powers left from the Keeper of Traken. Aliyoda ☎ 20:33, August 9, 2013 (UTC)
My theory that Hurt is 8.5 makes sense. http://doctorwhotv.co.uk/hurts-who-is-it-eight-nine-or-something-in-between-51151.htm