Howling:"Something's coming back."
Please DO NOT add to this discussion.
Well, I saw another interview with David Tennant where he mentioned, "...this is what finally defeats him [the Doctor], of course. And the forces that are gathering are unlike anything we've ever seen before. They're kind of, terrifying on a whole new scale. And we've been told that he will knock four times, something's coming to... Something's coming back. We've managed to keep a few suprsies for Christmas. Even if people think they know what's coming, I think they might be suprsied."
Something's coming back? I found it intriguing how he stopped and pasued when he was about to mentioned, 'something's coming to...' To do what, exactly? What's coming back, and what is it going to do? And what does he mean that 'forces are gathering'? Russel T. Davies said something very similar where he refered to them as 'dark forces are waiting'. It's all very intriguing.
According to David Tennant, people will be suprsied as to what is coming, and few will really guess what it is. This is just like how he said the four knocks was not the obvious answer (the Master). They even said that he will LITERALLY knock four times. The four knocks isn't just a sign or something returning- there will - literally - be four knocks, and the meaning of them knocks is a mystery. But it is constnatly descibed that the knocking is a very bad thing, Julie Gardner said she "couldn't bare it" when the four knocks (literally and finally) came.
Aside from all this Master and Naismith business, we have interivews mentioneding dark forces, something coming that no one will guess, something returning, literal four knocks that isn't the obvious answer, these 'dark forces' are like nothing we have ever seen before, they're apparantly terrifying, but I don't know in what context David mean- look terryfying, the amount of 'forces' gathering to battle the Doctor is terrifying, ect.. If you watch all the interviews, it really does look like they're hiding something. They directly mentioned something coming back and dark forces, but they're vauge. And mentioned suprsies and some unexpected things to happen/return. What do you all make of this? What are the producers hiding?
This adds to my theroy. Dark forces = the Doctor's enemeies are returning. Well, some of them. It seems perphaps the gathering 'dark forces' are most likely past enemies of the Doctor that are assosiated with things such as darkness or the dark. If these gathering dark forces is refering to enemies of the Doctor, I further state my Midnight theroy.
Saxon3, listen to the producers. Sure Naismith and the Master are the enemies to begin with, but Russel and David have been making it clear that there is so much more than that. For a start, two statmens about gathering 'dark forces' have been made, and statements about something returning, and something is coming back. How he mentioned that 'they're kind of terrifying on a whole new scale' really adds to the mystery. He was refering to the 'dark forces' when he mentioned terrifying, too.
Gathering dark forces most certainly sounds like enemies of the Doctor. Many enemies gathering. David Tennant said more than just the the above, however, in: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmOCkjfLMgA&feature=player_embedded# Delton Menace 00:34, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
Delton Menace do you think it is possible that Davros and the Daleks will also come back as well as the Beast/ Midnight Entity? the Doctor refered to the beast as the Kaled God of War, as Nainsmith might enslave the Master, maybe Nainsmith is really working for Davros , and making the Immoertality Gate to release the daleks that were trapped in the void in Doomsday, plus Davros could get the Beast to help him as he was refered to as the Kaled God of War91.106.19.37 10:00, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
- Yeah, and Catweazle is returning as well for The End of Time,while the real enemy are the Vogons. Get a grip, guys, the "something" that is coming is Galifrey. No beast, no Midnight entity, no Davros. The story centers around what it means to be a Time Lord. And - in a way - some might say, that the Time Lords are the "real enemies". 79.216.169.5 10:22, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
The Daleks are coming back for a short time in series 5. As for the entity above who commented, if you don't have any theories, then get lost. This is a theorizing post, not an ignorant bitchy post for you to rant. The producers have refered to the returning thing as being an entity more than anything, something that is going to do something. In other interviews, they refered to the dark forces moreso as being something to be feared, not a bunch of people. Entities from the dark.
Even the trailers refer to a darkness approaching. The four knocks prphecy basically proves Midnight's return if you actually watch both the episode closely. Four knocks prophecy = the Midnight entity. Dark forces = enemies of the Doctor. Both Midnight aqs the Beast are dark forces, and the producers go on about how dark forces are out to get the Doctor and something is returning. Yes. David Tennant said few or no one will guess what is returning, s ha-ha to you. Like the four knocks, it isn't the 'obvious answer' that most people assume. It's something most fans won't expecdt to return, and so you have to look deeper into past episodes and how they relate to what is building. In several episodes of Doctor Who so far, two things have been heard together: four knocks and 666.
In The Stolen Earth, a four beat rhythem was heard and the Beast's number came up. In Midnight, the entity copied four knocks and copied the Beast's number. In planet of the Dead, the Doctor was warned about for knocks and the Beast's number was hidden in UNIT's phone number. Also, a drum beat followed by four knocks was heard at least four times in the episode Midnight, four knocks were highlighted in the 'next time' trailer, four knocks were heard in the episode, and Midnight theme played in the four knocks prohphecy. Midnight said that it had been waiting in the dark and refered to itself as 'he'. When the Doctor was warned about the four knock, his fearful reaction matched his reaction to the events involving Midnight's knocking and attempt at killing him. Delton Menace 10:50, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
- Quote: "David Tennant said few or no one will guess what is returning, s ha-ha to you." Funny that you say that. There are dozens of theories on the web that Midnight or the Beast is returning, all refering to Midnights knocking (which, by the way, actually was a response to the Doctor, so the Doctor was causing it - and that's the hint). So if David is right, you have to be wrong....but is he right? Well... in a way...79.216.169.5 11:17, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
Do you think the producers really thought anyone would think it was Midnight? Nope. They think everyone will assume the Master, but they're probably not aware of the Midnight knocking and how it has somewhat become a talked-about theroy as of late. And again, Midnight replied instantly the three kncoks, but when the Doctor knocked four times, the entity remined very silent and replied after silence. Instead of knock fastly, when it came to the four knocks, the entity knocked slowly after a silence. And Midnight began with two knocks. In fact, the entity had a weird knocking pattern that went: knock, knock... knock, knock, knock.... knock, knock, knock, knock... After it knocked four times slowly and after a long silence, it went, per say, insane. I find that really odd. When the Doctor was warned of four knocks, he seemed to remember something by the look on his face, and his fear when hearing about it matched his fear to the events of Midnight's knocking.
Remember how the Doctor said he knew what the knocking meant, and he even said "I don't hear anyone knocking, do you?" This really does seem to link back with Midnight. Saying he knew what it meant and currently didn't hear anyone knocking. Yeah, the thing about Midnight is, he heard it knocking, and that was anm event (when he heard someone [Midnight] knocking). It is further supported by: "Soon, the knocking on the wall begins. Only a woman called Sky seems to know the truth"
Notice how even the plot highlights knocking, and it directly mentions a little thing called... the truth? The truth about the knocking? That says it all. The knocking on Midnight had some high relevance and the Doctor, out of all of them, was targeted by the knocking entity.
One of the passangers speaks for me when he directly highlighted Midnight's knocking, saying, "Think about it, though. That knocking." Another passanger also highlighted Midnight's knocking by mentioned that it knocked a number of knocks, saying, "It knocked three times!" And now the Doctor is warned about four knocks! Seriously, just think about it. And the drum beats followed by the four knocks that silently played at least four times in the episode- I believe a drum beat followed by four knocks first silently played when the Doctor told Midnight to stop it and they looked each other in the eye.
Then the Doctor communicated with Midnight by knocking four times, but it didn't reaply instantly. There was a very, very big silence. Then, after a long silence, Midnight - slowly - went 'knock, knock, knock, knock'. When it was three knocks it replied instnatly and quickly, but when the Doctor knocked (four times), nothing but silence until it replied. And it replied slowly, slow four knocks. Delton Menace 11:44, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
- Quote: "Do you think the producers really thought anyone would think it was Midnight?" Of course they would. Midnight aired not even a year before Planet of the Dead. It's more than likely than a lot of fans are watching Midnight again in the time between Planet of the Dead and The End of Time, realising that this thing is knocking. But maybe RTD put the knocking in Midnight as false trail, just as the drumming is a false trail, even though the Master is still hearing it. 79.216.169.5 12:21, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
I have a theroy that I don't paticularly support that there may be a connection between Midnight's knocking and the drumming. I only base this on how Midnight's knocking is like drum beats. But meh at that theroy. The drumming isn't a flase trail, either- it is very important for The End of Time, the plot mentions that the drumming is getting louder. But the episode has something to do with knocking, too. The Master hearing the drumming and the Doctor being warned of knocking... The knocking is important, too. Russel T. Davies said the knocking is very important, and it has a meaning.
I was atching Midnight just now, and when Midnight started going on about the dark and things like that, you hear a drum beat followed by four knocks as its theme plays, just like in the for knocks prphecy. I can't picture how I believe Midnight may return, but I strongly believe it will. I will note how the drumming (which has importance in The End of Time) is very similar to the knocking (which is also very important in The End of Time). Delton Menace 12:47, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
- The drumming itself is part of the plot, it is a Call to War, the Master says that himself, but the Doctor is not going to war, he's going to die. The four beat rhythm of the drumming is a false trail, we are suppossed to think that this is the "four knocks" as well as some are supposed to think Midnight's four knocks has something to do with it. But RTD isn't giving his hints so obviously. No one could guess what Bad Wolf means just by watching the episodes of Series 1. You should rather have a close look at Wilf, he is much more important for what's really going on in the End of Time than the Midnight Entity or the Beast 79.216.169.5 13:41, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
Wilfred Mott is an anogram for 'Time Lord' with the extra letters of 'F' 'T' 'W', but I don't think that means anything. I used to find the fact Wilfred Mott's anogramed name makes 'Time Lord', but the three extra letters ruins it. Unless, Wilfred Mott anogram = Time Lord FTW (for the win) = Time Lord victorious. Still don't believe it has any mean, though. :/
And yeah, I'm quite aware of Wilf's important role in the End of Time, his, as Russel T. Davies seems to hint, very unfortunate fate and the interperation of Donna's final words. Delton Menace 15:11, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
- btw I just watched that clip of Midnight again, and the entity is always knocking twice. Just after one guy knocks three times, the entity knocks three times and just after the Doctor knocks four times the entity knocks four times, so this is cleary just a response to the Doctor. Actually, if anyone is knocking four times in the episode it is the Doctor. 79.216.169.5 16:21, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
Exactly. That's where the knocking is coming from. When the Doctor was wanred about four knocks, he recognized the meaning of the knocking and Midnight's theme began playing. He quite obviously remembered when he knocked four times. And I don't know if you've been taking note of what I said about that scene- whenb it replies three knocks, it replies instantly and quickly. When it replies the Doctor's four knocks, there is a large silence. And when it finally replies after the silence, the knocks are slow.
The Doctor clearly pointed out that he knows what the knocking is in the Waters of Mars, and said that he didn't hear anyone knocking. He didn't say "I don't hear anyone knocking four times," he said, "I don't hear anyone knocking." Midnight knocked endlessly. And I'll say it again, Midnight's theme played when the Doctor was warned of the four knocks.
David Tennant said that the four knocks meant the Doctor's card had been marked. That's exactly what happened in Midnight. When he knocked four times, Midnight chose him and 'marked' his death card. Put two and two together. "The Doctor's card has been marked, and he will knock four times." Midnight marked the Doctor's card after replying four knocks. Seriously, just think about it.
And listen to what I'm saying:
Midnight is male
Midnight was waiting in the dark and targeted the Doctor
Midnight's theme played in the four knocks prophecy (you infamous ignore this)
A drum beat followed by four silent knocks played when Midnight began copying the Doctor, and he asked Midnight why it had chosen him.
Carmen: "He will knocm four times." -Midnight's theme plays- The Doctor's reaction to hearing this (as Midnight's theme plays with four knocks) is almost identical to his reaction to the events of Midnight's knocking. He points out in the next special that he doesn't hear anyone... knocking. Delton Menace 16:32, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
Maske up your mind, is it the bast or the midnight entity? The forces of darkness do not mean actual DARK things, it means evil or bad. The thing that is returning through the dark is Gallifrey, and ithe person that is causing the drum beats and who will knock four times is the narrator, if he was just narrating the story tennant would not have said how much fun it was working with dalton. once again there is more proof to suggest the master, naismith, the timelords and gallifrey than there is to suggest anything else. vote underneath if you think the real enemies are naismith the master and the timelordsd.Saxon 3 18:59, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
Time Lord's/Master/Naismith
--Revanvolatrelundar 19:09, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
--Mini-Mitch 19:10, December 20 (UTC)
--User:Darktimelord 5:03, December 21, 2009 {EST}
The Beast/Midnight Entity
91.106.19.37 20:12, December 20, 2009 (UTC) (unregistered user)
Delton Menace 20:24, December 20, 2009 (UTC)
What is your problem, Saxon3? You're so damn immature. I said directly that it's theorising, not a debate. If you don't support a theroy, you don't need to rant on and on about it and turn it into a great debate. My mind won't be changed unless the episode in both parts as a whole shows otherwise to what I believe. Cast listing and what we know officially so far isn't enough to change my mind. I need to see both parts. And don't state what you say as fact because, quite frankly, you haven't seen the part 2. Anything could happen. And the enemies I believe to be returning don't even requite actors, so that blurs cast listing out completely. They poses.
And I like to personally believe that the Beast and Midnight entity are one and the same, so don't go telling me to make my mind up there. I believe the Midnight entity was his living conciounse from after his body was destroyed. I noted how Midnight refers to once having had a corperal form, its assosiation with the dark. Now move on and accept that I have a theroy that you don't like.
And a story this long can have many enemies, I like to view Midnight as something that only appears at the very end. Delton Menace 14:17, December 24, 2009 (UTC)
I think that the story is going to be long because of the emotional journey the doctors going to take in the epipisode. I mean his favourite race is turned into the master. The time lords have returned (and they could be evil). And he knows hes going to die. But it would be cool if the enemies comes back--Theguy444 18:52, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
