Howling:Dividing the show into eras

The Howling → Dividing the show into eras

There be spoilers about un-released stories here.
Run back to the forums if you're scared.

The traditional division of Doctor Who is into the Classic Series and the New Series, sometimes with a third era for the "Wilderness Years" (the TV movie, and all the novels and audios before 2005). But as 89 pointed out in Howling:A collection of theories and questions regarding AotD and Oswin, in many ways Ace fits with the new series better than the first 24 seasons. (And of course she fits with the Wilderness Years even better, being the Doctor's companion through most of the first 35 NAs, out of 61.)

But really, as different as Ace is from Mel—both in character and in the kinds of stories told about her—she's just as different from Rose (or, for that matter, the EDA companions). And the difference is no starker than the one between, say, the Third Doctor's Avengers-style adventures on Earth with UNIT vs. the Second Doctor visiting future space colonies with Jamie and Zoe.

The show clearly doesn't just have two or three eras. So, where are the dividing lines? A few of them are obvious (the two sides of UNIT), but the rest are surprisingly hard to nail down. While I was thinking about this, I remembered that Tat Wood and Larry Miles already wrote a whole essay on this, and then used it as the basis for a series of 6 reference/commentary books, About Time. Looking at their division, I realized I disagreed, and now I have an answer.

First, About Time is divided:

1. Seasons 1-3 (1st Doctor)
2. Seasons 4-6 (2nd Doctor)
3. Seasons 7-11 (3rd Doctor)
4. Seasons 12-17 (4th Doctor until JNT took over)
5. Seasons 18-21 (4/JNT/Bidmead and 5th Doctor)
6. Seasons 22-Curse (6-8, counting Dimensions, the TV movie, and Curse, and with some discussion of the NAs, but almost no mention of the EDAs, NEDAs, and webcasts)
7. New series (not done yet, but it'll presumably cover up until Wood catches up with the show or kills the last tree on the planet trying)

I think the first two Doctors can go together, and you definitely have to draw a line at either Ace or Cartmel. And Bidmead is really a last gasp of the pre-JNT era. Also, if the EDAs and NEDAs are part of the new series rather than the Ace-Grace era, surely Curse is as well. So, here's my breakdown:

1. Seasons 1-6 (1st and 2nd)
2. Seasons 7-11 (3rd)
3. Seasons 12-18 (4th)
4. Seasons 19-24 (5th and 6th, 7th/Mel)
5. Seasons 25-TVM (7th/Ace, Dimensions, NAs, 8th/Grace)
6. EDAs-? (8th/Sam on, including the EDAs, NEDAs, and webcasts)

I'm a little uncomfortable lumping Hinchliffe/Holmes in with Williams, but I can live with this. --70.36.140.233^{talk to me} 03:17, October 6, 2012 (UTC)

do we even need to divide they show into eras? i mean, it's all the one show. i think the era dividing should be left to the person dividing at the time to show what they're differentiating, ie if one wants to talk about series 1-4 they can talk about the RTD era, but if they want to talk about just series 2-4 they can talk about the 10th doctor's era. neither is more valid than the other and suits what the person wants to say at the time. Imamadmad ☎ 03:50, October 6, 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Imamadmad on this. The perception of the "eras" depends both on experience (when did you start watching?) & personal tastes.

For example, having started watching at the opening of An Unearthly Child, I'd object fairly strongly to the idea that "the first two Doctors can go together". They very definitely were quite different, both in personality & in the show's "style". There's also the fact that the 2nd Doctor had to be seen quite differently from the 1st -- because there had been a regeneration. Right up to the closing moments of The Tenth Planet, he was not "the First Doctor"; he was quite simply "the Doctor". Nobody who wasn't a viewer before The Tenth Planet can appreciate the difference that first regeneration made. It was an unheard-of, totally novel idea that transformed both the Doctor & the show. Actors had, of course, been replaced in roles before that. Within the show in which it happened, however, the other characters "saw" no difference & the new actor had to (try to) play the character in the same way as the original actor had. Doctor Who tore up the rule book! Ben & Polly not only saw that the Doctor's face was different but argued about whether or not he really was the Doctor. That first regeneration changed things so much that a case could be made for saying that there are two eras in the show: From An Unearthly Child to The Tenth Planet, excluding that closing scene, and everything from the closing scene of The Tenth Planet onwards. Absolutely nothing in the show has ever made as much difference as that first regeneration.

By the way, 70, I assume that by "Seasons 22-Curse" you mean The Curse of Fatal Death, not (as I first read it) The Curse of Fenric. That's not a title it's wise to abbreviate at first instance.

Furthermore, there are many, including this wiki itself, who'd not regard The Curse of Fatal Death as being in any era of the show, which only goes to support Imamadmad's point. (I'm usually 89 or 2 but I'm 78, for now.) --78.146.187.111^{talk to me} 12:57, October 6, 2012 (UTC)

Imamadmad, you don't _have_ to divide the show into eras—but people _do_ discuss the show in those terms. Often there's an implicit assumption that the division at either Rose or the TV movie is the big fundamental divide in the history of Doctor Who. And yet, most fans, if they really think about it, will come up with other divides just as big or bigger. 89/2/78 argues for The Tenth Planet; Tat Wood argues for Spearhead from Space; Larry Miles has called at least three different stories "the point at which the show ceased to be Doctor Who". The question isn't really who's correct, but recognizing that the question isn't as simple as people assume. "The classic era" isn't a real thing. (That's not to say it has _no_ validity; it's certainly one of the better places to divide history. Just that it's not _the_ place to divide it.)

89/2/78: Yes, "Curse" meant The Curse of Fatal Death. And it is _definitely_ part of an era of the show. Of course the events within it are in no way part of the "mainline Doctor Who continuity", but that's not the same thing. This wiki makes that distinction: Curse—like the Unbound audios, but unlike the Stranger videos or the Faction Paradox audios—is out-of-universe part of Doctor Who (and therefore gets a page), but its events aren't in-universe part of the continuity (and therefore the page gets a scare-banner). It's an officially licensed production, with the same access to BBC assets as the new series, and was even sold as part of the Doctor Who VHS line. More importantly, just as much as the start of the BFAs, the Compassion arc in the EDAs, etc., Curse is a product of its time, and a big influence on what came later. --70.36.140.233^{talk to me} 08:14, October 8, 2012 (UTC)

Not only is the division into "eras" liable to be highly subjective but also it depends on what the purpose of the division is. A division that makes sense when discussing (say) how the companions were presented would make little or no sense when discussing how the special effects were done. It more-or-less has to be an ad hoc division made to suit whatever is being talked about at the time. --2.96.17.194^{talk to me}

agreed. that's the point i was trying to put across before. there is no need to "officially" divide the show into eras. people will do that at the time of speaking/writing/whatever to suit the time span they're talking about. for example, if i want to talk about all episodes before 1990, i would say during the classic era. if i just wanted to talk about the show during the 3rd and fourth doctor's reign, i would probably say the 70s era. if i just wanted to talk about while the 4th doctor was on our screens, i would say during the fourth doctor's era. if i just wanted to talk about the time when douglas adams was in charge of the show, i would say during the douglas adams era. each era i just mentioned was within the previous one i mentioned, and all divide the show to refer to not only different times in the show's history but different lengths of time in the show's history. that is why we cannot make "official" different eras. a reference to an era depends on what the person referencing needs to explain at the time. for example, if we decided that "officially" the time that tom baker played the doctor is one era, how would one then refer to the time that douglas agdams was in charge? or that romana was a companion? or the time that sarah jane smith was a companion, as she would then breach two different eras? see, it's much simpler if we just let people divide the show into different eras when they want where they think it is appropriate at that time. Imamadmad ☎ 09:46, October 9, 2012 (UTC)