Tardis talk:Apostrophe
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Showing ownership with words ending in Z
I'd like to propose changing the current policy, of which I've just become aware, of using only an apostrophe after the letter Z to show ownership to instead using an apostrophe followed by S. That is, Yaz's rather than Yaz'. Whilst both forms are acceptable, Merriam-Webster recommends z's and, indeed, if you search the wiki you'll find that the usage of "Yaz's" is already widespread. Additionally, the alternative name for Case File is Yaz's Case File, "Lopez's" is used in Lucifer Rising and "Fitz's" is used prolifically in the books, namely The Taint, Demontage and Unnatural History (which are the ones I have just checked). -- Saxon (✉️) 00:46, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
- If I'm not mistaken, the correct place for changing policy of this nature is Board:The Panopticon, although I will note my agreement to your point here. --Borisashton ☎ 00:50, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
- What is the British method? Shambala108 ☎ 00:51, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
- I'll just note that Merriam-Webster don't recommend z's in the link you shared, they said that either can be used, but 's is more common. (In fact they were referring to both words ending in 's' and in 'z' there) Furthermore, Merriam-Webster are an American company. I think what matters here is how it's said. If the 's is pronounced, it should be written. So generally I'd agree that it should be written [word]z's, as generally the 's' is pronounced. It'd be great to find what an authoritative source on British English says, though. Danochy ☎ 01:09, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
- No clear consensus. Lexico (Oxford) doesn't mention them but says that if it was spelled "Yas" we'd add the "'s". It also seems to suggest "Fez's" is correct. U of Sussex has no comment at all and also suggests that "Fez's" is correct. Plain English (probably not the most neutral source, but still) says to add "'s" to both. U of Melbourne (so Australia, but w/e) says both are acceptable. And the BBC itself doesn't comment on either, but says for singular nouns that end in "s" (not z,x, etc, just "s"), either are acceptable. Najawin ☎ 01:13, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
- There is as strong a case for only using ' when it's a plural possessive as there is for our current policy. This usage is widespread on the wiki at the moment, as pointed out. I agree this merits further investigation, though: is there a clear preference in British English for either convention? And what does that BBC source say about x and z endings?
× SOTO (☎/✍/↯) 02:41, June 22, 2020 (UTC)- It seems that Oxford calls for 's (see link) — "With personal names that end in -s: add an apostrophe plus s when you would naturally pronounce an extra s if you said the word out loud" — but I can't seem to find the primary source for the quotation.
× SOTO (☎/✍/↯) 02:53, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
- It seems that Oxford calls for 's (see link) — "With personal names that end in -s: add an apostrophe plus s when you would naturally pronounce an extra s if you said the word out loud" — but I can't seem to find the primary source for the quotation.
- There is as strong a case for only using ' when it's a plural possessive as there is for our current policy. This usage is widespread on the wiki at the moment, as pointed out. I agree this merits further investigation, though: is there a clear preference in British English for either convention? And what does that BBC source say about x and z endings?
- No clear consensus. Lexico (Oxford) doesn't mention them but says that if it was spelled "Yas" we'd add the "'s". It also seems to suggest "Fez's" is correct. U of Sussex has no comment at all and also suggests that "Fez's" is correct. Plain English (probably not the most neutral source, but still) says to add "'s" to both. U of Melbourne (so Australia, but w/e) says both are acceptable. And the BBC itself doesn't comment on either, but says for singular nouns that end in "s" (not z,x, etc, just "s"), either are acceptable. Najawin ☎ 01:13, June 22, 2020 (UTC)
