Theory:Doctor Who television discontinuity and plot holes/The Star Beast
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This page is for discussing the ways in which The Star Beast doesn't fit well with other DWU narratives. You can also talk about the plot holes that render its own, internal narrative confusing.
Remember, this is a forum, so civil discussion is encouraged. However, please do not sign your posts. Also, keep all posts about the same continuity error under the same bullet point. You can add a new point by typing:
* This is point one. ::This is a counter-argument to point one. :::This is a counter-argument to the counter-argument above * This is point two. ::Explanation of point two. ::Further discussion and query of point two. ... and so on.
- So the one way to fix the metacrisis is to just let it go, and Donna gets to keep her memories. Why didn't she just do that in Journey's End all those years ago?
- She has the benefit now of a) more time to think about it, compared to the first time the crisis started to hit, when she had seconds to consider whilst being increasingly unstable, b) fifteen years more wisdom and maturity, and c) a different perspective, with a family of people she loves and who support her, rather than having just lost her father, feeling purposeless and undefined as Donna, not helped by the poor relationship she endured with Sylvia the first time around. Giving up being "The Doctor-Donna" now is just surrendering a part of her identity to preserve all that; fifteen years ago it would have seemed like giving up everything that mattered.
- While that does make sense, Donna also mentions that she wanted to travel with the Doctor "forever" so if the only way to do that without getting her mind wiped is to "let it go", don't you think she would have done it?
- Agreed, she would have, given even a few minutes with a clear head to come to that decision- but during the first metacrisis, she didn't even have a few minutes. This could have been avoided if the Doctor had told her that it couldn't last while she was still stable, of course; but he didnt, likely because as The Family of Blood (TV story) shows, the Doctor himself is temperamentally incapable of understanding why he might willingly want to give up the "Doctor" element of his identity in order to lead a human life, despite his love,of humans and all the pain being the Doctor causes him; so in Journey's End (TV story) he simply would not conceive that there was a solution other than wiping her memory, and thus put off telling her until it was too late, out of compassion.
- The 14th Doctor explicitly states that Donna had a child (Rose) so the metacrisis passed down, splitting it up into both Donna and Rose - much like passing on genetics and so forth. The Doctor further states that this passing it down also slows down the metacrisis, hence why Donna and Rose are perfectly fine after the metacrisis is restored. Therefore, there is less of the metacrisis in her to dispel, hence it is easier to do now than it was before when it was literally burning her up.
- All that is true but the episode makes no implications that Donna couldn't have let it go earlier nor is it stated in the episode that Rose had anything to do with being able to let it go. Sure, it might be easier to do now but that doesn't mean it couldn't be done before. Ultimately, this still leaves the point of if Donna wanted to keep traveling with the Doctor and not die, why didn't she just let go earlier?
- She couldn't let it go before because there was too much metacrisis in her to do that. Again, as said above, the Doctor realises Donna getting pregnant and having a child meant she genetically passed down a large portion of the metacrisis energy. Therefore, now she could let it go since it wasn't as much to let go as before.
- All that is true but the episode makes no implications that Donna couldn't have let it go earlier nor is it stated in the episode that Rose had anything to do with being able to let it go. Sure, it might be easier to do now but that doesn't mean it couldn't be done before. Ultimately, this still leaves the point of if Donna wanted to keep traveling with the Doctor and not die, why didn't she just let go earlier?
- The 14th Doctor explicitly states that Donna had a child (Rose) so the metacrisis passed down, splitting it up into both Donna and Rose - much like passing on genetics and so forth. The Doctor further states that this passing it down also slows down the metacrisis, hence why Donna and Rose are perfectly fine after the metacrisis is restored. Therefore, there is less of the metacrisis in her to dispel, hence it is easier to do now than it was before when it was literally burning her up.
- Agreed, she would have, given even a few minutes with a clear head to come to that decision- but during the first metacrisis, she didn't even have a few minutes. This could have been avoided if the Doctor had told her that it couldn't last while she was still stable, of course; but he didnt, likely because as The Family of Blood (TV story) shows, the Doctor himself is temperamentally incapable of understanding why he might willingly want to give up the "Doctor" element of his identity in order to lead a human life, despite his love,of humans and all the pain being the Doctor causes him; so in Journey's End (TV story) he simply would not conceive that there was a solution other than wiping her memory, and thus put off telling her until it was too late, out of compassion.
- While that does make sense, Donna also mentions that she wanted to travel with the Doctor "forever" so if the only way to do that without getting her mind wiped is to "let it go", don't you think she would have done it?
- She has the benefit now of a) more time to think about it, compared to the first time the crisis started to hit, when she had seconds to consider whilst being increasingly unstable, b) fifteen years more wisdom and maturity, and c) a different perspective, with a family of people she loves and who support her, rather than having just lost her father, feeling purposeless and undefined as Donna, not helped by the poor relationship she endured with Sylvia the first time around. Giving up being "The Doctor-Donna" now is just surrendering a part of her identity to preserve all that; fifteen years ago it would have seemed like giving up everything that mattered.
- How exactly does Donna's metacrisis work? You'd think Donna would only have the Doctor's mind up until the point when she originally gained it during the metacrisis (the mind of the Tenth Doctor and preceding incarnations), but she seems to know his future or at least that he was a woman, something that hadn't happened to the Doctor by the time she gained his mind. Does this mean that Donna gained new incarnations mind's as part of the metacrisis every once and awhile? Or that she gained new parts of his mind once the Doctor reawakened the metacrisis in her? Or something else entirely? Does this also imply that other metacrisis beings that happen to have the Doctor's mind (like the Metacrisis Tenth Doctor) also subconsciously gain memories of the happenings of the regular Doctor?
- This would somewhat be explained in the next special, Wild Blue Yander, as Donna is indeed confirmed to have access to all the Doctor's memories even ones he hadn't experienced when she took on his mind, however, she's unable to access most of them.
- How does Rose's age work? Apparently, she's 15. But it's only been 14 years since Donna stopped travelling with the Doctor (yes, I know they SAY 15 years in the episode, but it's actually only 14 because of the the whole 12 months later Aliens of London thing). If you then throw in the End of Time happening ANOTHER year later (and Donna not being visibly pregnant), meaning the EARLIEST Rose could be born in summer 2011, meaning Rose should be MAXIMUM 12, which she clearly isn't (I know Russell T has said he deliberately messed with the timelines a bit in order for him to cast Finney who was 18 at the time, but that's an out of universe explanation, not an in universe one)
- Technically Russell T. Davies also somewhat gave an in-universe though he was mostly joking. The in-universe explanation makes mention of a time cloud that descended over Camden and dislocated everyone by exactly eight months and three days. That said, it most likely shouldn't be taken too seriously and even if it was meant to be taken seriously, Rose would at most be 14 not 15.
- Rose could have been adopted at an early age. Maybe the baby Donna was pregnant with was given up or didn't make it.
- If that would be the case Donna would have died after the Doctor reactivated the DoctorDonna and Rose would not have had everything passed on to.
- That relies on an overly literal, biological reading of the Metacrisis "passing down". It's a supernatural essence, not a blood disease; it's biodata-based and could very plausibly pass on via a ritualistic combination of emotional closeness plus prolonged proximity.
- The Doctor specifically says "but YOU had a daughter" and Donna doesn't refute that statement, this line and how the Nobles treat Rose in the episode definitely make it seem like she is Donna's biological child not adopted.
- Bio-data-wise, she's the daughter of Shaun and of The Doctor-Donna; although Donna's memories were locked, she was still part-Gallifreyan, and that was passed down to Rose Noble as well; chronological and biological ageing anomalies around the ageing process of such a child may be entirely consistent with this.
- The Doctor specifically says "but YOU had a daughter" and Donna doesn't refute that statement, this line and how the Nobles treat Rose in the episode definitely make it seem like she is Donna's biological child not adopted.
- That relies on an overly literal, biological reading of the Metacrisis "passing down". It's a supernatural essence, not a blood disease; it's biodata-based and could very plausibly pass on via a ritualistic combination of emotional closeness plus prolonged proximity.
- If that would be the case Donna would have died after the Doctor reactivated the DoctorDonna and Rose would not have had everything passed on to.
- Why is the TARDIS damaged so much by COFFEE? And, if it was POSSIBLE for it to be damaged to that extent, WHY would it out a coffee machine on the console?
- She wanted to test out her new cloister bell and have a good long run to stretch her engines at top speed after her refit, so put the coffee machine on the console in order to give herself an excuse.
- In all seriousness, it's worth noting that the TARDIS' change is still recent which might make it more suitable to damage as it's getting used to its new systems among other things. As for why the TARDIS put the coffee machine there in the first place, I'd assume it has something to do with the fact that the TARDIS just thought it was neat and would most likely get used. It probably wasn't thinking about the possible damage such a machine could cause to it at all.
- Why is Shirley Anne's wheelchair equipped with darts and rockets for emergencies but not a motorised engine? Surely, in a situation that would require her to use such weapons, she would also need a motorised wheelchair to allow her to get to safety quickly and out of danger.
- Because she is a person with free will and chose not to or maybe just didn't think of it.
- Perhaps it's an either/or choice; the power unit and ammunition storage and mechanism for the armaments may not leave enough room or weight allowance for a motor as well.
- It's also possible that UNIT offered one to her and advised her to take I but after seeing how skilled she was with using the manual one they realized it wasn't necessary.
- Alternatively, given the general mindset of UNIT scientific advisors, she possibly also has a motorised wheelchair, but just happened to be using the manually driven one today because she, Malcolm, Mel, and one or two of the Osgoods were half way through upgrading her electric wheelchair to be able to transform into an anti-grav hoverbout or an armoured exo-suit with built-in mini bar or similar, and consequently her motorised chair was in pieces on the workbench when the Meep's ship arrived.
- How do the cracks on the Earth reseal itself as if nothing has happened? We can clearly see some bricks falling through the cracks.
- Perhaps the double dagger drive has a temporal drive element to it; or, at least, uses technology that one-and-a-half Time Lords, working together, can turn into a rudimentary one in order to undo the damage it was doing to Earth; hence, the cracks were "un-happened" when the power was reversed. Either that or at least one alien invasion has left Transport for London in possession of some very efficient street maintenance nanotech.