Theory:Doctor Who television discontinuity and plot holes/The Giggle

You are exploring the Discontinuity Index, a place where any details or rumours about unreleased stories are forbidden.
Please discuss only those whole stories which have already been released, and obey our spoiler policy.

This page is for discussing the ways in which The Giggle doesn't fit well with other DWU narratives. You can also talk about the plot holes that render its own, internal narrative confusing.

Remember, this is a forum, so civil discussion is encouraged. However, please do not sign your posts. Also, keep all posts about the same continuity error under the same bullet point. You can add a new point by typing:

* This is point one.
::This is a counter-argument to point one.
:::This is a counter-argument to the counter-argument above
* This is point two.
::Explanation of point two.
::Further discussion and query of point two.

... and so on. 

• I keep seeing people say that after the Fourteenth Doctor's retirement he will "fully" regenerate into the Fifteenth Doctor but would that really be necessary? The Fifteenth Doctor already exists and thus would Fourteenth even be able to regenerate again? And if he could, Wouldn't he instead regenerate into a different incarnation?

15 says he's ok because 14 "got better", which implies that he still comes AFTER 14's "retirement", as he has those memories. So my interpretation is, at some point, 14 will die again, and then in the regenerative process he'll somehow be transported to the top of the helipad as 15 to come out of younger 14

Ah, that makes sense. I was mainly confused because if he did regenerate again and Fifteenth was instead "plucked" from a random point in his life then Fourteenth wouldn't be able to remember the encounter but if Fifteenth was instead "plucked" from Fourteenth "full regeneration" then it would indeed make sense as to why they still both get to keep their memories as they are both still the current incarnations of the character.

That seems to be the intent of RTD too.

EPSILON^🔎 |📯|📂|📦|📝

13:24, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

• Why does "everyone thinking they're right" equate to "everyone becomes paranoid bigots". Yes, SOME people would, but even Kate starts having a go at Shirley and thinking there's some red headed conspiracy theory going on.

Think about it for a second. If everyone in the world started believing they were right then yeah it would be total madness. I mean you try to have a civil discussion with them and they just keep correcting everything you're saying as they think they're right and you're wrong. The Toymaker and The Doctor themselves both also point out that 21st Century Earth is a pretty f'ed up place already. All the Toymaker did was push everyone over the edge so that everyone believed they were "right" which is pretty much just a blunt way of saying superior to everyone that isn't them which somewhat explains Kate as well as she saw herself as "right" and superior to Shirley and the red-heads (and presumably everyone that isn't her). I suppose long story short, the Toymaker didn't just make everyone believe they were "right," he instead made everyone believe ONLY they were right which essentially means they believe everyone else was wrong.

But there's still a difference between "I'm better than Shirley" and "you don't need a wheelchair you're faking", and a difference between "I'm better than people with red hair" and "oh my god there are 2 people her who are redheads this must be some grand conspiracy".

If everyone believes they are right, then they also believe what they think and say is true. In the moment of passionate anger, Kate had the thought of conspiracies cross her mind - she thought her thinking that was right, so she believed the conspiracies were true, hence then saying what she said. The Toymaker removed people's ability to use logic and rationality in all aspects, so naturally Kate did too.

• One potential plot hole has occurred to me. In the episode, the Doctor makes it clear that the Toymaker can't help but follow the rules of a game and accept to play a game when challenged by the Doctor. In both instances he does this, the Toymaker instantly stops his meddling and taunting and proceeds to play the game. Per the fairness rules, this seems to also limit the Toymaker's power to that a regular human given (in both the High Card and Catch games) he doesn't do any of his outlandish elemental manipulating actions. Therefore, since challenging the Toymaker instantly causes him to stop his meddling, why does the Fourteenth Doctor take so long to challenge the Toymaker to the third game? In the build up to the second game, it makes sense because the Toymaker is literally "toying" with and mocking the Doctor, inciting him to play the second game and risk losing since (at that point) the Doctor had already won their first game so did not need to play a second game - he only does as he concedes it as the only way to stop the Toymaker meddling with Earth and to shut him up about the tragedies he has committed between his 11th and 14th bodies. However, in the third game, he spends loads of time shouting and berating the Toymaker and demanding he leaves his friends alone. When challenging the Toymaker is the way to stop this - and he has to do it anyway to abide by the "Best of Three" rule - why does he take so long to do it? Had he done it earlier, he could have (potentially) averted his regeneration and would have stopped the Toymaker harassing his friends.