Howling:Dreams
I've been puzzled by the point of the bit in TToA where River quotes from the book "What if we had ideas that could think for themselves? What if one day our dreams no longer needed us? When these things occur and are held to be true, then the time will be upon us. "The Time of angels"" , and there's a lot of dream related bits in other episodes as follows:
TEH the coma patients dreaming and all saying "Doctor", PZ says about little Amelia "Dreaming of the magic doctor she knows will return to save her", Amy then dreaming of the room and what she saw in it forces PZ to replicate himself so the Atraxi can recapture it,
TBB Liz 10 brought up on legends of the Doctor who turns out to be real ?
VotD Bracewell remembering his artifical memories to stop the bomb
TToA / FaS hallucinogenic lipstick induces a dream state, the quote at top of this post
TVoV Roseanna says to the Doctor "Remember us. Dream of us..."
AC 2 dreamworlds both seeming totally real, the Dream Lord's refection in the console
THE / CB ? Eldane's speech about not forgetting the past or the Doctor and his losses etc
VatD ?
so my theory is that in TPO / TBB Amy remembers in her dreams things which have been erased from reality, ie Rory and the Doctor and the TARDIS and somehow this brings them all back
Any thoughts? 86.26.137.154 06:21, June 12, 2010 (UTC)
TL The Doctor says to Craig "...but frankly I'm an absolute dream." 86.26.137.154 09:04, June 15, 2010 (UTC)
TPO Rory says to the Doctor "Just here like I'd woken up from a dream.Started to think it was a dream. You and Amy and Leadworth" 86.26.137.154 07:50, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
Frankly, I've been thinking for quite a while now that all the dream references are a way go leading up to the "but the whole series 5 is a dream" -- but as a red herring. Beside just being terrible, there are things that quite literally point out the link to reality, such as the Byzantium adventure being referenced by River in a previous story with Doc 10 (in the Library after handcuffing the Doc).
But I do subscribe to her remembering something and bringing it back. I don't know if it will be everyone/everything, but it will at least be Rory. I think the Doc has to fix at least some of this on his own. BrainySpecs 08:11, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
So let's look at the dialogue again:"What if we had ideas that could think for themselves? What if one day our dreams no longer needed us? When these things occur and are held to be true, then the time will be upon us. "The Time of angels"" Doesn't make sense in terms of what we saw in the actualy story. It could just be mood dilogue but ... What are the 'ideas' that are thinking for themselves? It reads like something that is imagined has become real, an idea has taken on form and is now a thinkng (and living?) thing. The question becomes what is it that has become real.
- The pandorica is inspired from a fiction but it doesn't seem to be the thinking kind.
- The Doctor appears after Amy wished for him (I do believe in fairies, I do! I do!) is he a fiction made real?
- Young Amy is a fairytale? Made real from the Doctor's imagination; his need for a companion? Is she now able to make him real in return?
- Older Amy a figment of the imagination of a scared child wanting to be safe?
- Amy's house, not the thinking kind of thing unless it's haunted with terrible memories.
It would be sad to see eveything wev'e seen this washed away as it was 'all a dream' and I really Don't think that Moffat is so unimaginative. However, I have no problems thematically with a bluring or 'reality' and 'fiction'; reality forming around fantasy. It might be a bit meta-fictional but old Doctor Who did touch on these ideas. Jack Chilli 08:59, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
Thinking again we did see something being made real from an idea. The Angel in Amy's mind was becoming real from an idea; a memory of an image. An example of fiction becoming real? Jack Chilli 09:02, June 22, 2010 (UTC)
Adding to what Jack just said, I'd like to point out that Moff seems to like the idea that knowing yourself or thinking you are human somehow makes you so, even if you're not. think: VoTD, Bracewell "becomes human" by remembering "himself," or Rory in TPO, who isn't the real Rory at all but manages to hold off turning into an evil killing machine by "remembering" his implanted memories. Very "Bladerunner"-esque. 134.94.242.98 12:33, June 22, 2010 (UTC)Roquelle
