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| ==Not a fanfic page==
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| Come on folks. I know the TARDIS Wikia's rules are a bit looser than they are at Wikipedia, but still ... the ending of the article turned into complete fanfic. Please remember this is supposed to be an encyclopedia of some sort... [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 01:52, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
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| :I agree. This isn't fanfiction.net, this is still a Wiki, even if it's not wikipedia. [[User:AnimeNoKyouran|AnimeNoKyouran]] 01:54, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
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| I'm not sure if this comment refers to the TARDIS coral section, but this is a debate, and was mentioned in more than one magazine. Russell T Davies even discussed it in DWM 398, so it is most definately not fan fiction, it refers only to a deleted scene. -Anonymous
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| It's not refering to the TARDIS coral, it's refering to the original article which I rewrote. It was very Doctor/Rose lovey dovey, (which I guess the whole idea of the Meta-Crisis Doctor kinda is) but I trimmed it down to keep it to the facts of the conversation on Bad Wolf Bay rather than personal thoughts or feelings about what happened. --[[User:Sazzrah|Sazzrah]]
| | == A day to come? == |
| | Do we really need this section here, given that this is NOT an actual incarnation of the Doctor? I think this is based on a misunderstanding of the [[Eleventh Doctor]]'s whole "vanity issues" statement in ''[[The Time of the Doctor (TV story)|The Time of the Doctor]]'', which actually places the "Twelfth Incarnation" as the Doctor who appears from [[Journey's End (TV story)|''Journey's End'']] to ''[[The End of Time (TV story)|The End of Time]]'', not this guy. Which, thinking about, shouldn't that also necessitate a splitting of our [[Tenth Doctor]] page? [[User:NightmareofEden|NightmareofEden]] [[User talk:NightmareofEden|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:49, 25 December 2021 (UTC) |
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| == He isn't a clone... ==
| | :: There's little to no point splitting the Tenth Doctor's page, as he essenial regenerated back into himself. He even affirms as much in ''Journey's End'': ''"Used the regeneration energy to heal myself, but soon as I was done, I didn't need to change. I didn't want to. Why would I? Look at me. So, to stop the energy going all the way, I siphoned off the rest into a handy bio-matching receptacle, namely my hand. "'' & ''"I'm still me."'' Then, in ''The Time of the Doctor'', the Eleventh Doctor reiterates with; ''"Number Ten once regenerated and kept the same face."'' So, what would have been the tenth regeneration (at the time) was instead used in conjunction with [[the Tenth Doctor's hand]] to create the "Meta-Crisis Doctor", thus justifying the "A day to come" subsection covering mentions of future regenerations. BananaClownMan 04:30, 26 December 2021 (UTC) |
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| Would be good if this article could be renamed something like half-human Doctor or time lord/human hybrid doctor... Since he is not a clone in the slightest and using the term on an encyclopedia only serves to encourage the use of this innacuracy. --[[User:Sazzrah|Sazzrah]]
| | ::: I agree with Nightmare of Eden, the page's current format makes no sense. [[User:OttselSpy25|OS25]][[User Talk:OttselSpy25|🤙☎️]] 00:17, 15 March 2023 (UTC) |
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| : Makes Sense to Me [[User:Dark Lord Xander|Dark Lord Xander]] 03:44, 11 July 2008 (UTC) | | ::::I both miss arguing with Eden, and agree with her. [[User:Najawin|Najawin]] [[User talk:Najawin|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 00:45, 15 March 2023 (UTC) |
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| ::Ye, he's not really a clone at all; I don't know why people discuss him as being a clone, he's "unique"!. Anyway we should try to come up with a list of good names because i'm sure it could be named quite a few different things.--[[Special:Contributions/88.104.90.198|88.104.90.198]] 20:43, 13 July 2008 (UTC)
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| === Suggestions ===
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| *'''Clone Doctor''' - ''NO already!''
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| *'''Half-Human Doctor'''
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| *'''Half-Human Tenth Doctor'''
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| *'''Half-Human Meta-Crisis Doctor'''
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| *'''Half-Human Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor'''
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| *'''Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor'''
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| *'''Meta-Crisis Doctor'''
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| *'''Ten-and-a-Halfth Doctor'''
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| *'''Duplicate Doctor'''
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| How about '''Half-Human Doctor (Meta Crisis)''' to distingish from the 8th doctors claims that he may be half human [[User:Dark Lord Xander|Dark Lord Xander]] 01:18, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
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| :I think we should ignore the 8th Doctors claims about being half-human; all other doctors claim to a Time Lord. But I think '''Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor''' is most accurate, as he's still the tenth Doctor but he's a human Time Lord biological meta-crisis Doctor.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 12:28, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
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| Seems like a ligical idea [[User:Dark Lord Xander|Dark Lord Xander]] 06:59, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
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| ::I myself would've gone a completely different direction. I would've opted for [[Doctor (Pete's World)]] to keep him consistent with other residents of that parallel universe. That's the simplest, most concise name for who he really is. The whys and wherefores of him, which this title now stresses, are really beside the point. A decade from now, when ''Journey's End'' isn't so new and shiny, we'll have forgotten almost everything about this one-episode character, but we will remember this: he's the Doctor that got to live with Rose in Pete's World. '''[[User:CzechOut|<span style="background:blue;color:white">Czech</span><span style="background:red;color:white">Out</span>]]''' [[User talk:CzechOut|☎]] | [[Special:Contributions/CzechOut|<font size="+1">✍</font>]] 06:12, 17 July 2008 (UTC) | |
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| That would work only if the doctor came from petes world as jackie and rose went to live there and funny enough they are called Jackie and Rose if you wanted to go down that road it would have to be [[Doctor (who now lives in Pete's world)]] besides he came around from a Meta-crisis were as the other doctors regenerated hence first, second ect [[User:Dark Lord Xander|Dark Lord Xander]] 06:21, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
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| ::Leaviog that to one side for the moment, the MOS says his name is [[Doctor (Journey's End).]] '''[[User:CzechOut|<span style="background:blue;color:white">Czech</span><span style="background:red;color:white">Out</span>]]''' [[User talk:CzechOut|☎]] | [[Special:Contributions/CzechOut|<font size="+1">✍</font>]] 22:20, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
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| :::'''Duplicate Doctor''' - it's what the Time Traveller's Almanac refers to him as, as well as being the name on his Basttles in Time card.
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| :::: [[Julie Gardner]] calls him simply the '''Human Doctor''' in the ''Confidential'' associated with the episode. Elegant, simple, and from the BBC. '''[[User:CzechOut|<span style="background:blue;color:white">Czech</span><span style="background:red;color:white">Out</span>]]''' [[User talk:CzechOut|☎]] | [[Special:Contributions/CzechOut|<font size="+1">✍</font>]] 02:21, 18 April 2009 (UTC)
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| :::::A popular name for Doctor #2 by a majority of fans is "The Other Doctor", because he is the Doctor, but he's not '''the''' Doctor. <span style="color: #0000CC;">[[Special:Contributions/80.177.217.162|80.177.217.162]] 11:09, 17 May 2009 (UTC)</span>
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| I removed the category Clones because he isn't a clone. A clone is an exact reproduction of genes, he isn't a clone of the Doctor because he's half-Human, the Doctor is a Time Lord (who is also perhaps half-Human). I think the people who call him a clone need to do some research on what a clone actually is. I'm A Hydroponic Tomato! [[User:Bigredrabbit|Bigredrabbit]] 00:30, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
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| I think it should be renamed "Meta-Crisis Doctor", the "Tenth" makes it seem like he's an actual incarnation of the Doctor, when he's really a seperate individual. I'm A Hydroponic Tomato! [[User:Bigredrabbit|Bigredrabbit]] 00:27, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
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| How does it make it seem like an incarnation, the Meta-Crisis naming helps to distinguish the fact. I think you need to re-watch the episode, or re-read the article. --[[User:Bigshowbower|Bigshowbower]] 04:25, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
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| ===For===
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| *--I'm A Hydroponic Tomato! [[User:Bigredrabbit|Bigredrabbit]] 00:27, December 26, 2009 (UTC)
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| ===Against===
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| == Home Planet ==
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| Just wondering shouldnt the home planet be Pete's World not just "None" --[[User:Bigshowbower|Bigshowbower]] 03:15, 11 October 2008 (UTC)
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| or TARDIS cos he was born in there (I know its not a planit though)
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| == Fanfic-like editing! ==
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| I've changed this several times now, removing all the fanfic-esque romantic drivel that keeps getting put in! If anyone is reading this to edit the page again, please ask yourself the following question before you make changes:
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| "Is what I'm writing FACT or my OPINION?"
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| If the answer is OPINION, do not write it!
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| For example, comments like: ''"Rose and the half-human Doctor look into reach others eyes lovingly knowing they will have a wonderful future together.''" is OPINION, not fact. Do not put these types of comments in, it's utterly ludicrous. If you want to read stuff like that then go to www.fanfiction.net not wiki! --[[User:Sazzrah|Sazzrah]] 20:18, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
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| == Russell T. Davies' Book "The Writer's Tale" ==
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| Since there are huge sections of that book which cover the events of Journey's End, specifically reasons for re-writing the original drafts of the Bad Wolf Bay scene; I think the following link might be of interest to people here:
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| http://community.livejournal.com/time_and_chips/5584493.html
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| This is a livejournal entry I personally wrote for the Doctor/Rose community 'Time & Chips', which contains the scripts for the Bad Wolf Bay scene typed out in full, along with emails written by Russell T. Davies and Benjamin Cook. It might help clear up some of the confusion about the [[TARDIS coral]] canonicity too. I'm no pro on editing Wikis so I will leave this information in someone elses more capable hands! --[[User:Sazzrah|Sazzrah]] 20:44, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
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| ==Don't forget in-universe style==
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| Just a reminder that articles on characters need to primarily be written in "in-universe" style, as if they actually existed, and all references to scripts, actors, and real world matters need to be placed under a "Behind the scenes" heading. I've reorganized the article accordingly (and updated it a bit with regards to the deleted scene). As Sazzrah correctly states above, though, that doesn't mean the in-universe stuff needs to resemble fanfic. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 02:49, 19 November 2008 (UTC)
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| == The Forgotten 5 ==
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| Given the developments in Doctor who: The Forgotten, don't you think we should update the page with the character's notable change?
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| Is that canon though?
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| :It is canon on this website. So, yes, put it up here. -<[[User:Azes13|Azes13]] 18:05, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
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| I'm kind of disgusted by this development. Can't we ignore it?
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| :No. That's not very encyclopaedic. -<[[User:Azes13|Azes13]] 02:46, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
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| :I'd wait till you pass any such judgment... We have no idea if it really is him or not. All we know is that it's someone acting/looking like him. Besides, if it turns out that the Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor IS the Valeyard, as makes a lot of sense, then this works quite nicely.
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| If you really want to de-canonize it, then if you can find something that contradicts it, you may be able to get it a mention on the wiki page, as is done on the [[Death Comes to Time]] page regarding the [[Doctor Who: The TV Movie]].--[[User:TheOmnius|TheOmnius]] 04:37, 19 January 2009 (UTC)
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| :The Forgotten #6 indicates that the parasite that infects the doctor is impersonating the Valeyard. In issue #5 the Doctor refers to this impersonation being the Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor. However this contradicts the fact that the Valeyard was created between the Doctor's twelfth and final regenerations. This could mean that he doesn't become the Valeyard until than, or it could mean he isn't the Valeyard at all. We likely won't know for a very very long time. --[[User:Deepbluesky|Deepbluesky]] 10:05, 24 January 2009 (UTC)
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| ::I can't find anything in Issue 5 making any reference to the Meta-Crisis Doctor in this context. And in Issue 6 there is no reference to this either; the Doctor rather scoffingly refers to this person as the Valeyard, realising by now it's all a ruse, and that's it. So it's all nonsense, and I hope this has been an object lesson to us in jumping the gun (I'm guilty of it, too). I've eradicated all references that suggest the Meta-Crisis Doctor has anything to do with The Forgotten (save for the one behind-the-scenes reference). In future I recommend waiting until all chapters of a story unfold before making assumption (again, I'm guilty of that myself, so shame on me, too). There is the unanswered question as to why the artist chose to draw the Valeyard-impersonation looking like the Tenth Doctor, however. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 22:00, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
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| :::This is actually the result of a printing error. For some reason the dialogue for page 1 of issue 6 didn't print. This has been corrected in the trade paperback. Tony Lee (the comic's author) explains it himself [http://forum.idwpublishing.com/viewtopic.php?t=5303&highlight= here]. The corrected dialogue directly references the character as the Meta-Crisis Doctor. [[User:Zinc Saucier|Zinc Saucier]] 00:18, January 8, 2010 (UTC)
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| == Part human ==
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| In at least one point in Journey's End the Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor refers to himself as part human, part Time Lord. I'm not sure there's any authoritative on-screen source to suggest that he is '''half''' anything.
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| This has some important implications when it comes to Donna's Meta-Crisis, and the half-human statement from 1996.
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| Can anyone find a reliable source to indicate if the MCTD is half human and half Time Lord?--[[User:TheOmnius|TheOmnius]] 17:53, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
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| == Meta-Crisis Doctor ==
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| I belive that it should be renamed Meta-Crisis Doctor insted of Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor. Putting the Tenth in there establishes him as being an incarnation of the Doctor, whereas he is infact a completely different indvidual, who is just based on the Doctor's genes. Seeing as he is referred to as the Doctor, I believe that Doctor should still be kept in there. Another suggestion is The Doctor (Meta-Crisis) or The Doctor (Journey's End) [[User:Bigredrabbit|Bigredrabbit]] 23:44, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
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| * Your suggestions are good, however it becomes problematic because this clone (or whatever) is identified closely with the Tenth Doctor and is in fact a copy of the ''Tenth'' Doctor. He's not a copy of the Seventh or Fourth Doctor. And he doesn't regenerate. Therefore he remains associated with a single version of the Doctor. Although unlikely we don't know if someday we might learn of a Meta Crisis Doctor copying another incarnation. We also don't know if he continued calling himself the Doctor after going off with Rose. Calling him The Doctor (Meta-Crisis) is a bit too broad.
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| == Is it wrong? ==
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| The doctor did give him a piece of the tardis, not sure if it was cut for america or something, but i watched it and meta crisis doctor was given a piece.
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| However ,i do think that the scene has been changed a bit.
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| * Please sign your comments. The scene you're referring to was cut from all versions of the episode, but included as a bonus feature on the DVD. Because it's a deleted scene, it cannot be said for 100% certain that it's canon. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 17:42, December 3, 2009 (UTC)
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| == Home planet==
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| We can't say "Gallifrey/Earth" as his home planet. Since he was created within the TARDIS, he technically has no home planet. So all we can say is Pete's World as his adopted home for now. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 17:42, December 3, 2009 (UTC)
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| ==Children of Time template==
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| I thought the whole Children of Time business referred only to the Doctor's companions? If so, then the M-C Doctor shouldn't be included as one. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 22:49, January 25, 2010 (UTC)
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