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Talk:The Woman (The End of Time): Difference between revisions
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She's a Time Lady, you can see her in the preview of Ten spinning around and shooting someone with Wilf's gun. | She's a Time Lady, you can see her in the preview of Ten spinning around and shooting someone with Wilf's gun. He's behind him next to the President of the Time Lords in Time Lord Robes. It's possible she's Romana or the Rani... | ||
*Interesting. I hadn't noticed her in the preview, but my theory before that had been that she might be the White Guardian, finally returning. She appears and disappears (and communicates) mysteriously, wear's a white suit (and had a white background on TV), and is apparently trying to stay somewhat distanced from things (avoiding the Doctor knowing she's there). I'd also heard a theory that the White and Black Guardians were gone since the Time War, because they were no longer needed since the destruction of the Time Lord and Dalek races... if that theory has any credence than now that the Time Lords are back, it would make sense for the Guardians to return as well. Of course this could also just be my mind jumping to conclusions since I saw [[Enlightenment (TV story)|Enlightenment]] only a couple weeks ago... who knows. ;-) --[[Special:Contributions/173.33.173.112|173.33.173.112]] 17:46, January 1, 2010 (UTC) | *Interesting. I hadn't noticed her in the preview, but my theory before that had been that she might be the White Guardian, finally returning. She appears and disappears (and communicates) mysteriously, wear's a white suit (and had a white background on TV), and is apparently trying to stay somewhat distanced from things (avoiding the Doctor knowing she's there). I'd also heard a theory that the White and Black Guardians were gone since the Time War, because they were no longer needed since the destruction of the Time Lord and Dalek races... if that theory has any credence than now that the Time Lords are back, it would make sense for the Guardians to return as well. Of course this could also just be my mind jumping to conclusions since I saw [[Enlightenment (TV story)|Enlightenment]] only a couple weeks ago... who knows. ;-) --[[Special:Contributions/173.33.173.112|173.33.173.112]] 17:46, January 1, 2010 (UTC) | ||
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Although we have Julie and RTD says she's the Doctor's mother, until it is actually stated as such in either an episode or some other media (novel, comic, etc) we can't put her in the "Relatives of the Doctor" category yet. For all we know Moffat may decide that she's Romana or Susan or the Doctor's ''wife'' instead. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 02:14, January 4, 2010 (UTC) | Although we have Julie and RTD says she's the Doctor's mother, until it is actually stated as such in either an episode or some other media (novel, comic, etc) we can't put her in the "Relatives of the Doctor" category yet. For all we know Moffat may decide that she's Romana or Susan or the Doctor's ''wife'' instead. [[User:23skidoo|23skidoo]] 02:14, January 4, 2010 (UTC) | ||
Her manager said she is the Doctor's mother too. Moffat doesn't intend to go back and reveal things like this on-screen because he wants to tell new stories, so it may never be said on-screen. However, if the producers and her manager confirmed it, ACCEPT IT. That is just the way it is. All sources have sited her as the Doctor's mother even before the episode aired, too. No point in trying to bypass it. | Her manager said she is the Doctor's mother too. Moffat doesn't intend to go back and reveal things like this on-screen because he wants to tell new stories, so it may never be said on-screen. However, if the producers and her manager confirmed it, ACCEPT IT. That is just the way it is. All sources have sited her as the Doctor's mother even before the episode aired, too. No point in trying to bypass it. | ||
It was even said that the nature of the episode is that it was a mother [the Woman] helping her son [the Doctor] make the right choice and save humanity. And she is seen to be ver caring of the Doctor in the same fashion as a mother would be to a son. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 10:41, January 4, 2010 (UTC) | It was even said that the nature of the episode is that it was a mother [the Woman] helping her son [the Doctor] make the right choice and save humanity. And she is seen to be ver caring of the Doctor in the same fashion as a mother would be to a son. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 10:41, January 4, 2010 (UTC) | ||
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Thank you, Golden Monkey. There should be a policy for that on the wiki... Confirmed in commentery and/or interview = canon. Unfortunateloy, people just don't listen to what the writers and producers, and even her manager say. It is very irritating. An example is that it was confirmed long ago that Lucy Saxon didn't pick up the ring, but no one listened to what they said but me. And then the episode airs, and they realise the truth. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 19:01, January 5, 2010 (UTC) | Thank you, Golden Monkey. There should be a policy for that on the wiki... Confirmed in commentery and/or interview = canon. Unfortunateloy, people just don't listen to what the writers and producers, and even her manager say. It is very irritating. An example is that it was confirmed long ago that Lucy Saxon didn't pick up the ring, but no one listened to what they said but me. And then the episode airs, and they realise the truth. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 19:01, January 5, 2010 (UTC) | ||
::'''There absolutely, positively should not be such a policy.''' | ::'''There absolutely, positively should not be such a policy.''' In fact, I think current policy does not consider interviews and commentaries higher sources of information than the episodes themselves, and that's how it should be. Producers are inveterate liars when asked about their work in a public interview. They're '''using''' the media to spin something. Listen to the recent ''[[Who on Who]]'' for RTD frankly admitting this. We should not and '''cannot''' take information that is '''not''' in an episode as superior to what '''is''' in an episode. | ||
::And what's in this episode? | ::And what's in this episode? Wilf directly asking the Doctor who The Woman was, and the Doctor deliberately not answering. That's all that matters. No matter what's said in commentaries, the writer went out of his way to create ambiguity, so the answer to the question, "Who is The Woman?" can only be, "I do not know." | ||
::All the rest is spin. | ::All the rest is spin. But you know what? I've listened to the commentary with great, great care and, in the words of RTD, "I think you're mad". At no point does RTD ''ever'' definitively back away from the ambiguity he so deliberately scripted. See more details below. '''[[User:CzechOut|<span style="background:blue;color:white">Czech</span><span style="background:red;color:white">Out</span>]]''' [[User talk:CzechOut|☎]] | [[Special:Contributions/CzechOut|<font size="+1">✍</font>]] 03:51, January 17, 2010 (UTC) | ||
. | . | ||
:: | :: | ||
= Noticed Something = | = Noticed Something = | ||
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However, she tells him to just accept it or something along the likes of that. Later, he does. She later refers to her genrally as the Doctor's mother, and he can be heard now agreeing. Also, the actresses manger said the woman who plays the Woman is the Doctor's mother, as well as multiplke sources. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 00:30, January 6, 2010 (UTC) | However, she tells him to just accept it or something along the likes of that. Later, he does. She later refers to her genrally as the Doctor's mother, and he can be heard now agreeing. Also, the actresses manger said the woman who plays the Woman is the Doctor's mother, as well as multiplke sources. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 00:30, January 6, 2010 (UTC) | ||
:Even Gardner isn't as sure as you're making her out to be. | :Even Gardner isn't as sure as you're making her out to be. Not that it matters, really, cause all that matters is what's on screen, but at one point (36:10) the commentary goes: | ||
::JG: "They all go for the Doctor's mother, but here's enough doubt for it to be a much wider and open . . . " | ::JG: "They all go for the Doctor's mother, but here's enough doubt for it to be a much wider and open . . . " | ||
::RTD: ". . . whatever you want." | ::RTD: ". . . whatever you want." | ||
:Also I take issue with Delton Menace's characterization that RTD can "be heard now agreeing" with JG's "Doctor's mother" assertion. | :Also I take issue with Delton Menace's characterization that RTD can "be heard now agreeing" with JG's "Doctor's mother" assertion. I never got the impression he was ever giving up on the ambiguity he had deliberately written in to the script. Please post proof or retract. Need a time code for this moment where RTD definitively says "Yes, that's the Doctor's mother." '''[[User:CzechOut|<span style="background:blue;color:white">Czech</span><span style="background:red;color:white">Out</span>]]''' [[User talk:CzechOut|☎]] | [[Special:Contributions/CzechOut|<font size="+1">✍</font>]] 03:36, January 17, 2010 (UTC) | ||
== The Doctor hasn't got a mother! == | == The Doctor hasn't got a mother! == | ||
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=date of episode= | =date of episode= | ||
The article previously mentioned that the first time she appeared was Dec 23 2010. | The article previously mentioned that the first time she appeared was Dec 23 2010. I changed this to 2009 since that is the obvious timing for the episode. Is there some specific reason to think that this Christmas was a year ahead? --[[User:Jdvelasc|Jdvelasc]] 18:58, January 18, 2010 (UTC) | ||
There is none... The Next Doctor took place in the past, which allowed The End of Time to take place on Christmas 2009. However, this also places Planet of the Dead and The Sarah Jane Advetnures series 3 in 2009, too. But they pretty much fit. | |||
Children of Earth was September 2009, SJA series 3 October and November 2009, The End of Time December 2009. Both this years and last years stories take place in the same year as part of Russell T. Davies cleaning things up for Moffat. Seriues 5 Doctor Who seemingly spans 2010. Also, there was apparantly a moment in commentary where Donna's second wedding taking place in early 2010 (spring) was mentioned. People don't realise how the timeline is in sync as of now. All they needed to do was date this year's stories ina certain was to have them take place in the same year as last years stories. [[User:Delton Menace|Delton Menace]] 04:35, January 19, 2010 (UTC) | |||
