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Forum:Temporary forums/Inclusion debates speedround: Difference between revisions
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Forum:Temporary forums/Inclusion debates speedround (view source)
Revision as of 16:54, 22 April 2023
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As for the fact that… | As for the fact that… | ||
{{ | {{quote|[[DWMSE 30]] also tells us in the original script, there's a bit where the Doctor does a telephone mime which means "vote for me" in ''The X Factor'' before turning to the camera,|User:SOTO}} | ||
as they say, this was pointedly ''cut'' from the final version. Besides, quick sideways glances to the camera have happened in all kinds of episodes e.g. ''[[Heaven Sent (TV story)|Heaven Sent]]''. If we're not bothered about "A merry Christmas to all of you at home" in ''[[The Daleks' Master Plan (TV story)|The Daleks' Master Plan]]'', then in the face of all the other evidence that this is ''not'' meant to be a meta thing, I really don't think we should lose any sleep about a blink-and-you'll-miss-it glance at the camera ''which didn't make it into the finished product''. | as they say, this was pointedly ''cut'' from the final version. Besides, quick sideways glances to the camera have happened in all kinds of episodes e.g. ''[[Heaven Sent (TV story)|Heaven Sent]]''. If we're not bothered about "A merry Christmas to all of you at home" in ''[[The Daleks' Master Plan (TV story)|The Daleks' Master Plan]]'', then in the face of all the other evidence that this is ''not'' meant to be a meta thing, I really don't think we should lose any sleep about a blink-and-you'll-miss-it glance at the camera ''which didn't make it into the finished product''. | ||
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I think it is proven beyond doubt that ''[[The Body in Question (comic story)|The Body in Question]]'' should be covered. As Ottsel said: | I think it is proven beyond doubt that ''[[The Body in Question (comic story)|The Body in Question]]'' should be covered. As Ottsel said: | ||
{{ | {{quote|I understand that to us "''Doctor Who'' universe" is more of a state-of-mind… but I can not think of another instance of anyone trying to argue that a story which ''features the Doctor being name-dropped'' does not establish that it takes place within the Doctor's universe to a level of satisfaction.|User:OttselSpy25}} | ||
But I will go further and extend the same ruling to ''[[Synchronicity II (comic story)|Synchronicity II]]'' (the actual title of the story in ''Revolutionary War: Death's Head II'' — that's the name of the ''publication'') and to the irritatingly-named ''[[The Bo(d)y in Question (comic story)|The Bo(d)y in Question]]'' (the actual title of the four-part story in the 2019 ''Death's Head'' miniseries). Yes, these are minor appearances. But as I just restated, going out of your way to show Keepsake's Vulture in Death's Head past ''is'' going out of your way to reference the character's origins being steeped in the DWU. It's like whenever [[Iris Wildthyme]] stories go back to [[Hyspero]]. It's going out of its way to say "this isn't just the preexisting Magrs-owned Iris we're dealing with here, this is ''the'' Iris who adventured with the Eighth Doctor in ''[[The Scarlet Empress (novel)|The Scarlet Empress]]''". And beyond that, as Ottsel said, covering every subsequent licensed appearance of characters who debut in ''Who'' stories is… | But I will go further and extend the same ruling to ''[[Synchronicity II (comic story)|Synchronicity II]]'' (the actual title of the story in ''Revolutionary War: Death's Head II'' — that's the name of the ''publication'') and to the irritatingly-named ''[[The Bo(d)y in Question (comic story)|The Bo(d)y in Question]]'' (the actual title of the four-part story in the 2019 ''Death's Head'' miniseries). Yes, these are minor appearances. But as I just restated, going out of your way to show Keepsake's Vulture in Death's Head past ''is'' going out of your way to reference the character's origins being steeped in the DWU. It's like whenever [[Iris Wildthyme]] stories go back to [[Hyspero]]. It's going out of its way to say "this isn't just the preexisting Magrs-owned Iris we're dealing with here, this is ''the'' Iris who adventured with the Eighth Doctor in ''[[The Scarlet Empress (novel)|The Scarlet Empress]]''". And beyond that, as Ottsel said, covering every subsequent licensed appearance of characters who debut in ''Who'' stories is… | ||
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…I keep making ''Star Trek'' comparisons, but I think a lot of frustration here comes from the fact that there is some sentiment that we should in fact treat ''Death's Head'' like [[Iris Wildthyme]]: a <s>one-</s>two-of-a-kind "honourary" DWU character, who may have debuted outside the DWU but became so defined by it that we should just make a special decision to bend [[T:VS]], and go the whole hog to cover all his appearances without trying to hide behind vultures and namedrops. | …I keep making ''Star Trek'' comparisons, but I think a lot of frustration here comes from the fact that there is some sentiment that we should in fact treat ''Death's Head'' like [[Iris Wildthyme]]: a <s>one-</s>two-of-a-kind "honourary" DWU character, who may have debuted outside the DWU but became so defined by it that we should just make a special decision to bend [[T:VS]], and go the whole hog to cover all his appearances without trying to hide behind vultures and namedrops. | ||
{{ | {{quote|[''Kangs for the Memories!''] seems like something which would be fine to simply note, but also seems like it could be of utility simply in giving a full picture.|User:TheChampionOfTime}} | ||
And I am, to be sure, sympathetic to this position. ''Increasingly'' sympathetic, the more of this tangled web we unravel. But ''that'' is much too broad and much too unique a proposal to be handled in a Speedround like this. The Speedround was good for correcting the application of ''current'' policy, as in the case of these three further appearances by the vulture. But I really don't think such an afterthought of a discussion should be held in such a format — nor do I think th epeople who brought it up meant for it to be resolved here. | And I am, to be sure, sympathetic to this position. ''Increasingly'' sympathetic, the more of this tangled web we unravel. But ''that'' is much too broad and much too unique a proposal to be handled in a Speedround like this. The Speedround was good for correcting the application of ''current'' policy, as in the case of these three further appearances by the vulture. But I really don't think such an afterthought of a discussion should be held in such a format — nor do I think th epeople who brought it up meant for it to be resolved here. | ||
