Talk:Gallifreyan (language)

Identical with English?

Look at The History of the Time War. It is clearly written in English. If the Gallifreyans wrote it for themselves, there is no reason it should be in English unless they use it themselves. Movsar ☎ 13:39, April 29, 2013 (UTC)

The "circular" and "Greek" scripts could be just codes or ciphers. – The preceding unsigned comment was added by Movsar (talk • contribs) .

We don't know that the history of the time war was written by a Gallifreyan. It's a pretty impossible book considering that the Time War is still happening and that everyone involved in it is time locked away. We don't know who wrote it or what language it was written in. Also, we were seeing the book as Clara saw it, and she'd have been able to read anything in the library regardless of what language it was in because of the TARDIS translation circuits. We hear people who are really speaking any other language as English. Real world or not. Dead or not. This is both because it's the only way the series works for viewers without subtitling EVERYTHING, and because this is how the Doctor's companion experiences things. For all we know the Doctor speaks mostly Gallifreyn, not English. All of this goes for writing too. Anoted ☎ 14:01, April 29, 2013 (UTC)

How do you know the Doc does not speak English? Obviously he could communicate using supernatural means (I'm sure this is possible in DWU) but what about the episode with Rose noticing that he speaks with a "northern accent" and the Doctor replies "lots of planets have a north" ? I think this could be an indication that not only he speaks English, but all Gallifreyans do. Movsar ☎ 12:40, April 30, 2013 (UTC)

Well, I know this topic is almost exactly one year old but I would like to add my own view about Gallifreyan language, that is, I wouldn't hold all my trust in the TV show if it's this term we are talking about. It's not only it's continously contradicting in its own, but doesn't have the basis the expanded universe manages to unify and clarify with all those loose ends TV show leaves with their cancelation, in an enough decent way. The Doctor does indeed talk in Gallifreyan everytime and has not even the faintest idea about speaking in English, according with Dead of Winter.

Virgin books show clearly several Gallifreyan terms which are never translated in a human code, such as Sepulchasm, Kithriarch, sufixes at the end of names like "-ssor", which supposedly designates the word "son/daughter of" in High Old Gallifreyan, and makes obvious their compound language by some traslated words as "Lungbarrow", "Blyledge", "Flutterwing" and "Trumpberry".

In Borrowed Time, I believe to remember the Time Lord claims to have more verb terms in his own language that would simplify his expression a lot, and they would understand him even before he'd start to talk.

However I wouldn't need proofs to prove that Gallifreyans wouldn't ever learn how to speak a language that is not their own, since they consider in more or less level primitive to the most part of the creatures of the universe, and meaningless to understand their cultures. It's a short-minded idea to think a pan-dimensional and far-advanced civilization would resign themselves with a so simple tongue like the English, which doesn't have even the verb terms to define the different positions matter can occupy in time for them.

We don't have to stop there, Gallifreyans are a telepathic species. That means they don't even need to open their mouth to express their emotions, even although events throughout history forced them to fold their consciousness into their minds they're fully capable. This intrinsic ability is deeply rooted in the Gallifreyan culture as far as they combined it with their technology to create more stable and manageable structures, technology which also appears in the basic circuits of the TARDIS. Even if this is not a concept explained by any element of the DWU, it may be possible translation circuits wouldn't be more than a manifestation of the symbiosys between the pilot and the machine, just acting like an expansion of the telephatic field of the person in question in order to be understood by the alien recipient, without the need of learning a new language. The Doctor would agree in spreading that expansion to their companions, even the spectator themself, so they can also understand foreign conversations. Nerea266 ☎ 11:21, May 1, 2014 (UTC)

Sourced needed on most of this, especially the idea of "events" folding a Time Lord's consciousness into a mind (???). If it's not even in a Big Finish play or a Virgin book, it has no purpose to our discussion pages. According to T:VS, only sources from stories count when we build this wiki up (though as T:IU says, we treat TV and expanded universe citations with equal weight).

Also I'm pretty sure Dead of Winter is directly contradicted by a lot of televised evidence, such as the "biggest fan" comment in The Unquiet Dead, basically any of the Shakespeare in-jokes in The Shakespeare Code, the Doctor associating Amy's "a christmas carol" with the Ghost of Christmas Past, Present and Future in A Christmas Carol, and the "no, don't do that" when his companions try to speak another English-language dialect in Code, Tooth and Claw and The Unicorn and the Wasp. -- Tybort (talk page) 12:15, May 1, 2014 (UTC)

There's also this bit from The Fires of Pompeii.

Donna: Although while we're here, wouldn't you recommend a holiday, Spartacus?

Tenth Doctor: Dunno what you mean, Spartacus.

Donna : Well, this lovely family, mother and father and son. Don't you think they should get out of town?

Caecilius: Why should we do that?

Donna: Well, the volcano for starters.

Caecilius: The what?

Donna: The volcano.

Caecilius: The what-ano?

Donna: That great big volcano right on your doorstep.

Tenth Doctor: Oh, Spartacus, for shame, we haven't even greeted the household gods yet. (whispering) They don't know what it is. Vesuvius is just a mountain to them. The top hasn't blown off yet. The Romans haven't even got a word for volcano. Not until tomorrow.

From this, it seems very hard to claim that the Doctor doesn't understand Latin or English speech simply because the TARDIS translates speech and writing for humans. Maybe that's just me though? -- Tybort (talk page) 12:44, May 1, 2014 (UTC)