Talk:Maestro
The Drumming or the Main Theme?[[edit source]]
In both this article, and the article for The Devil's Chord, the tune that Maestro plays to control the Tardis is linked in relation to Saxon - The Drumming here, and Saxon's Theme there. Now, I think this identification is coming from the subtitles on Disney+ ("[playing the Saxon theme off key]"). The subtitles on iPlayer, however, read "DISTORTED VERSION OF DOCTOR WHO THEME". (unless I'm wrong and there was a different reason for that connection)
I've argued on other wikis in the past that subtitles are not necessarily a good source of disambiguation for a text; they're often blatantly incorrect. I'm not sure I'd make the same argument here, because the BBC tends to be very diligent in its captioning, but with the dual platform release and the subtitle tracks seeming to be different between them, it might be worth hashing out whether we can use them for disambiguation, and if we can, which one we use if they contradict each other. - CodeAndGin | 🗨 | 14:39, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Well, a wrinkle to all of this is that the Drumming is a meta joke about the beat of the theme song in the first place. The source of the Master's "madness", their obsession with the Doctor, is reified by "has had the beginning of the Doctor Who theme song stuck in their head for millennia". --Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 20:32, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Oh certainly, but I find it more likely that RTD was riffing on the theme itself as the meta joke in this scene, and not a meta joke to another separate meta joke about the theme. Regardless, my point about use of the subtitles still stands, though it may warrant a forum post over this talk page. - CodeAndGin | 🗨 | 21:07, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Unclear to me that this is the case, Saxon hijacked the Tardis before, after all. Najawin ☎ 21:09, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Absolutely agreed about broader problems with subtitle conflict, but I think you didn't quite see my point — which is that arguably, "Maestro played the Drumming" and "Maestro played the first drumbeat of the Who theme song" are not different statements but simply two ways of saying the same thing. --Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 21:18, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Ah, I see. I'm not certain I'd personally agree exactly, but honestly I'm more concerned with the subtitle thing than the semantics of this specific case. I'm drafting a forum post for this in my sandbox atm. - CodeAndGin | 🗨 | 21:29, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Absolutely agreed about broader problems with subtitle conflict, but I think you didn't quite see my point — which is that arguably, "Maestro played the Drumming" and "Maestro played the first drumbeat of the Who theme song" are not different statements but simply two ways of saying the same thing. --Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 21:18, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Unclear to me that this is the case, Saxon hijacked the Tardis before, after all. Najawin ☎ 21:09, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Oh certainly, but I find it more likely that RTD was riffing on the theme itself as the meta joke in this scene, and not a meta joke to another separate meta joke about the theme. Regardless, my point about use of the subtitles still stands, though it may warrant a forum post over this talk page. - CodeAndGin | 🗨 | 21:07, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
Not really convinced this needs a thread? We've always taken iPlayer to be definitive over anything else afaik, even over DVD releases or Amazon subtitles or anything similar. Disney+ seems to be in the same basket. Najawin ☎ 21:41, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- Ah, this may be another case of me being relatively new to editing the wiki and missing some precedence. I'll keep the draft there for a while just in case tho - CodeAndGin | 🗨 | 23:01, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- tbf, I did look for a thread in Forum:Panopticon archives and didn't see one off hand, so if there's an explicit statement of this, it's somewhere else. But I recall we discussed it at /groans/ Talk:Hatbox. Najawin ☎ 23:06, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- ngl, I had a good hearty chuckle at the /groan/ there. Having a quick skim over it, the subtitle mentions are more or less what I've said here about iPlayer being generally reliable, and there's a vibe there that we're taking iPlayer as having more weight, if not in those words as such, so I'd say that's probably enough for me to not bother continuing the draft.
- tbf, I did look for a thread in Forum:Panopticon archives and didn't see one off hand, so if there's an explicit statement of this, it's somewhere else. But I recall we discussed it at /groans/ Talk:Hatbox. Najawin ☎ 23:06, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
- PS: Just wanna say that I just recently watched Talons on iPlayer, and it is very much a victim of the awful subtitling of classic Who that I noted in my draft. I didn't specifically note the spelling they used but I did laugh when 4 said hatbox. - CodeAndGin | 🗨 | 23:27, 11 May 2024 (UTC)
