Talk:Remembered TARDIS: Difference between revisions

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::: And that name is also used in publicity material. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:32, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
::: And that name is also used in publicity material. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:32, 1 November 2023 (UTC)


:::: I guess this is the question: does there need to be ''confirmation'' that this TARDIS is a memory, or is the TARDIS being called that reason enough? And on a similar note: the status of the characters themselves is nebulous, whether they're real, or memories, psychic avatars, etc. So that's why I thought making pages like [[Fifth Doctor (Tales of the TARDIS]] could be a sensible proposition. [[User:TheGreatGabester|TheGreatGabester]] [[User talk:TheGreatGabester|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:42, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
:::: I guess this is the question: does there need to be ''confirmation'' that this TARDIS is a memory, or is the TARDIS being called that reason enough? And on a similar note: the status of the characters themselves is nebulous, whether they're real, or memories, psychic avatars, etc. So that's why I thought making pages like [[Fifth Doctor (Tales of the TARDIS)]] could be a sensible proposition. [[User:TheGreatGabester|TheGreatGabester]] [[User talk:TheGreatGabester|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:42, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
::::: I don't think so. I'm fairly sure it's intended to take place in the ordinary Doctors' and companions timelines. (For example, the Seventh Doctor gives an explanation as to why he's old, which they probably wouldn't bother doing otherwise.) <u>[[User:Aquanafrahudy|<span style="font-family: Georgia ; color: pink" title="Hallo." > Aquanafrahudy</span>]] [[User talk: Aquanafrahudy|<span title="Talk to me">📢</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Aquanafrahudy|<span title="Stuff I've done">🖊️</span>]] </u> 14:45, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
:::::: Sure, but the implication here is the room may or may not be a physical location; it's left open that it could be entirely mental or imaginary. So it does complicate things somewhat. [[User:TheGreatGabester|TheGreatGabester]] [[User talk:TheGreatGabester|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:47, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
::::::: Oh, entirely. But I don't think it's [[Twelfth Doctor (Shadow World)]] level. We just document it in an ambiguous manner on the respective characters' pages. Respecting the integrity of the ambiguity of the narrative, as it were. <u>[[User:Aquanafrahudy|<span style="font-family: Georgia ; color: pink" title="Hallo." > Aquanafrahudy</span>]] [[User talk: Aquanafrahudy|<span title="Talk to me">📢</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Aquanafrahudy|<span title="Stuff I've done">🖊️</span>]] </u> 14:52, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
:At least we have a clear vision of when it takes place for the companions in their timelines. [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 15:06, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
:I am in favor of going with Memory TARDIS if it is indeed called that both in dialogue and in promo materials. [[User:Time God Eon|Time God Eon]] [[User talk:Time God Eon|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 18:09, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
::Both work for me, and are far better choices than what we currently have. It is explicitly called those things, and even for navigation purposes it makes a lot more sense to choose one of them. [[User:StevieGLiverpool|StevieGLiverpool]] [[User talk:StevieGLiverpool|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 20:30, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
 
:::Okay, so it has now been 3 weeks since the last comment on this subject, which was in favour of either name. Should a rename be enforced given that there has been no further disagreements to it? [[User:Danniesen|Danniesen]] [[User talk:Danniesen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 10:25, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
 
:: I'd say we go with "Remembered TARDIS", on the grounds that it was used by two Doctors (5/6), while "Memory TARDIS" was just used by one (7). [[User:BananaClownMan|BananaClownMan]] [[User talk:BananaClownMan|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 10:40, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
 
::: I am also in favour of "Remembered TARDIS" × [[User:Fractal|Fractal]] [[User talk:Fractal|<span title="Talk">•</span>]] 16:36, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
 
:::: {{done}}. --[[User:Scrooge MacDuck|Scrooge MacDuck]] [[User talk:Scrooge MacDuck|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 17:00, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
 
::::: And, as if to be an untimely nuisance, I would just note now I've seen this Talk discussion that all six scripts for TOTT do in-fact consistently notate the location as either "INT. MEMORY TARDIS" or "INT. THE MEMORY TARDIS". [[User:JDPManjoume|JDPManjoume]] [[User talk:JDPManjoume|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 17:17, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
 
== Central console ==
 
The page currently says "The console room was a small chamber with no central console". Should the console in the middle of the ceiling count as a central console or not? The time rotor is just visible in the interior image currently on the page and there's a clear shot of the whole console at 3:40 in TotT Earthshock {{Unsigned|83.100.235.175}}
 
:Fair point, I'll change it to "no traditional central console". [[User:TheGreatGabester|TheGreatGabester]] [[User talk:TheGreatGabester|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 18:58, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 
== Subpage for layout ==
 
I've had some fun trying to be eagle-eyed with this set, but I do worry about legibility and the impact it has on the general shape of this page. The page seems unbalanced with the sort of sprawling chunky layout section as part of it. I think it might be better suited to a subpage. (Other people's thoughts on the formatting of the layout section are welcome, as well.) [[User:TheChampionOfTime|TheChampionOfTime]] [[User talk:TheChampionOfTime|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 22:18, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
 
== Other Remembered TARDISes ==
Something of note is that when this TARDIS is named in ''Tales of the TARDIS'', it is referred to as "a Remembered TARDIS" or "a Memory TARDIS", as in being of a type of TARDIS. The recent ''[[I, TARDIS (novel)|I, TARDIS]]'' suggested that other Memory TARDISes were seen at the end of ''[[The Five Doctors (TV story)|The Five Doctors]]'' when the TARDIS undergoes [[temporal fission]]. How should we separate things so that there is a page for this specific TARDIS as well as Memory TARDISes in general? [[User:TheChampionOfTime|TheChampionOfTime]] [[User talk:TheChampionOfTime|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 12:29, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
: I'm not convinced that the ontology here is such that other remembered versions of ''the'' TARDIS would be "other Remembered TARDISes" as opposed to, as it were, "[[Twice Upon a Time (TV story)|others of the ''same'' Remembered TARDIS]]". What's the quote from ''I, TARDIS''? --[[User:Scrooge MacDuck|Scrooge MacDuck]] [[User talk:Scrooge MacDuck|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 12:51, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
::The full quote is as follows:
{{Simplequote|All that displaced temporal energy, and all the power I’d been bottling since my overhaul, led to excited echoes of myself breaking away to deliver them safely home. And from there … well, I’m not sure. Did they melt away? Did they offer fresh adventures to those past reflections of the Doctor, taken out of time? Did they become safe havens for dreaming shades and strays across the Doctor’s history? Perhaps all of the above, perhaps none. Those were the first Memory TARDISes – though, as it turned out, not the last.|The TARDIS|I, TARDIS (novel)}}
::[[First Doctor's Memory TARDIS]], [[Second Doctor's Memory TARDIS]], etc? [[User:TheChampionOfTime|TheChampionOfTime]] [[User talk:TheChampionOfTime|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:32, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
 
::: Not quite a response to the matter at hand, but wasn't the Remembered TARDIS meant to be a very specific phenomenon where the extrapolated and projected memory of a time machine kinda willed itself into existence? How is ''that'' anything similar to what we see in ''The Five Doctors''? {{User:Epsilon the Eternal/signature}} 14:09, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
 
::::Steve Cole being far too much of a fan, retconning the VFX from the end of The Five Doctors. I always just assumed at the end of The Five Doctors, the TARDIS was returning each person back to their timestream and the "floating away TARDIS.jpg" effect was just a visual shorthand. Now, Cole has retconned it to suggest that, actually, the end of Five Doctors has the TARDIS temporarily(?) create "memory TARDISes" in order to transport the respective characters back to their timestreams(?) <font face="Maven Pro" color="#000000"><b>— [[User:Fractal|Fractal]] [[User talk:Fractal|<span title="Talk">•</span>]]</b></font> 19:37, 20 July 2024 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 19:37, 20 July 2024

"Memory TARDIS"[[edit source]]

I would contend that "The Doctor's TARDIS (Tales of the TARDIS)" is a better name than "Memory TARDIS", as the dialogue keeps it ambiguous as to what this TARDIS really is, if it's real, a memory/dream, etc.; the Doctor is just guessing, and is unsure. TheGreatGabester 14:27, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

"Memory TARDIS" is explicitly used in the Curse of Fenric one, though it is called "a" memory TARDIS, so it ought really to be at Memory TARDIS (Tales of the TARDIS). Aquanafrahudy 📢 🖊️ 14:30, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
"Remembered TARDIS" is also explicitly used in dialogue, by Davison. — Fractal Doctor @ 14:31, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
And that name is also used in publicity material. Danniesen 14:32, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
I guess this is the question: does there need to be confirmation that this TARDIS is a memory, or is the TARDIS being called that reason enough? And on a similar note: the status of the characters themselves is nebulous, whether they're real, or memories, psychic avatars, etc. So that's why I thought making pages like Fifth Doctor (Tales of the TARDIS) could be a sensible proposition. TheGreatGabester 14:42, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
I don't think so. I'm fairly sure it's intended to take place in the ordinary Doctors' and companions timelines. (For example, the Seventh Doctor gives an explanation as to why he's old, which they probably wouldn't bother doing otherwise.) Aquanafrahudy 📢 🖊️ 14:45, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Sure, but the implication here is the room may or may not be a physical location; it's left open that it could be entirely mental or imaginary. So it does complicate things somewhat. TheGreatGabester 14:47, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Oh, entirely. But I don't think it's Twelfth Doctor (Shadow World) level. We just document it in an ambiguous manner on the respective characters' pages. Respecting the integrity of the ambiguity of the narrative, as it were. Aquanafrahudy 📢 🖊️ 14:52, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
At least we have a clear vision of when it takes place for the companions in their timelines. Danniesen 15:06, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
I am in favor of going with Memory TARDIS if it is indeed called that both in dialogue and in promo materials. Time God Eon 18:09, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Both work for me, and are far better choices than what we currently have. It is explicitly called those things, and even for navigation purposes it makes a lot more sense to choose one of them. StevieGLiverpool 20:30, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
Okay, so it has now been 3 weeks since the last comment on this subject, which was in favour of either name. Should a rename be enforced given that there has been no further disagreements to it? Danniesen 10:25, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
I'd say we go with "Remembered TARDIS", on the grounds that it was used by two Doctors (5/6), while "Memory TARDIS" was just used by one (7). BananaClownMan 10:40, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
I am also in favour of "Remembered TARDIS" × Fractal 16:36, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
Tardis Blue check mark.png Done!. --Scrooge MacDuck 17:00, 6 March 2024 (UTC)
And, as if to be an untimely nuisance, I would just note now I've seen this Talk discussion that all six scripts for TOTT do in-fact consistently notate the location as either "INT. MEMORY TARDIS" or "INT. THE MEMORY TARDIS". JDPManjoume 17:17, 6 March 2024 (UTC)

Central console[[edit source]]

The page currently says "The console room was a small chamber with no central console". Should the console in the middle of the ceiling count as a central console or not? The time rotor is just visible in the interior image currently on the page and there's a clear shot of the whole console at 3:40 in TotT Earthshock The preceding unsigned comment was added by 83.100.235.175 (talk • contribs) .

Fair point, I'll change it to "no traditional central console". TheGreatGabester 18:58, 3 November 2023 (UTC)

Subpage for layout[[edit source]]

I've had some fun trying to be eagle-eyed with this set, but I do worry about legibility and the impact it has on the general shape of this page. The page seems unbalanced with the sort of sprawling chunky layout section as part of it. I think it might be better suited to a subpage. (Other people's thoughts on the formatting of the layout section are welcome, as well.) TheChampionOfTime 22:18, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

Other Remembered TARDISes[[edit source]]

Something of note is that when this TARDIS is named in Tales of the TARDIS, it is referred to as "a Remembered TARDIS" or "a Memory TARDIS", as in being of a type of TARDIS. The recent I, TARDIS suggested that other Memory TARDISes were seen at the end of The Five Doctors when the TARDIS undergoes temporal fission. How should we separate things so that there is a page for this specific TARDIS as well as Memory TARDISes in general? TheChampionOfTime 12:29, 20 July 2024 (UTC)

I'm not convinced that the ontology here is such that other remembered versions of the TARDIS would be "other Remembered TARDISes" as opposed to, as it were, "others of the same Remembered TARDIS". What's the quote from I, TARDIS? --Scrooge MacDuck 12:51, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
The full quote is as follows:
"All that displaced temporal energy, and all the power I’d been bottling since my overhaul, led to excited echoes of myself breaking away to deliver them safely home. And from there … well, I’m not sure. Did they melt away? Did they offer fresh adventures to those past reflections of the Doctor, taken out of time? Did they become safe havens for dreaming shades and strays across the Doctor’s history? Perhaps all of the above, perhaps none. Those were the first Memory TARDISes – though, as it turned out, not the last."The TARDIS [src]
First Doctor's Memory TARDIS, Second Doctor's Memory TARDIS, etc? TheChampionOfTime 13:32, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
Not quite a response to the matter at hand, but wasn't the Remembered TARDIS meant to be a very specific phenomenon where the extrapolated and projected memory of a time machine kinda willed itself into existence? How is that anything similar to what we see in The Five Doctors? 14:09, 20 July 2024 (UTC)
Steve Cole being far too much of a fan, retconning the VFX from the end of The Five Doctors. I always just assumed at the end of The Five Doctors, the TARDIS was returning each person back to their timestream and the "floating away TARDIS.jpg" effect was just a visual shorthand. Now, Cole has retconned it to suggest that, actually, the end of Five Doctors has the TARDIS temporarily(?) create "memory TARDISes" in order to transport the respective characters back to their timestreams(?) Fractal 19:37, 20 July 2024 (UTC)