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== Referring to Companions by surname? ==
== Main Image Change ==


"He had a habit of referring to his companions by surname.."
I want to change the main image for the Eleventh Doctor's page. Can I do that? I've uploaded the image that I would use. [[User:King of the Sandmen|King of the Sandmen]] [[User talk:King of the Sandmen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:25, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
<gallery widths="185">
ElevenInShadowsTDODT.jpg|Current image (#1).
Eleventh Doctor Closing Time.jpg|[[User:King of the Sandmen]]'s proposal (#2).
Eleven Closing Time Crop.jpg|Crop with bowtie (#3).
Eleven Closing Time very close crop.jpg|Even tighter crop. (#4)
Eleventh Doctor in Bells of Saint John Prequel.jpg|[[WC]]: ''[[The Bells of Saint John: A Prequel (webcast)|The Bells of Saint John: A Prequel]]''. (#5)
Eleventh Doctor with fez.jpg|With fez, from [[TV]]: ''[[The Day of the Doctor (TV story)|Day of the Doctor]]''. (#6)
Eleven during talk with Curator.jpg|"Knowingsmile" from [[TV]]: ''[[The Day of the Doctor (TV story)|Day of the Doctor]]''. (#7)
Troughtonian Eleven in Vincent and the Doctor.jpg|Kind, genial smile in [[TV]]: ''[[Vincent and the Doctor (TV story)|Vincent and the Doctor]]''. (#8)
Eleven during talk with Curator cropped.jpg|"Knowingsmile" from TV: Day of the Doctor. Cropped. (#9)
Troughtonian Eleven in Vincent and the Doctor cropped.jpg|Kind, genial smile in TV: Vincent and the Doctor. (#10)
Eleventh Doctor The Power of Three.JPG|The Doctor realises that Amy is "all grown up". (#11)
</gallery>


I don't think this is true. Sure, he referred to Amy by "Pond" but he called Rory, River, Craig, Jenny and Clara by their first name. I think this is much more common and can't think of examples other than Amy. [[User:Badwolff|Badwolff]] [[User talk:Badwolff|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 22:11, May 19, 2013 (UTC)
:There has to be a discussion first with big pages like this, and an admin has to give a final ruling. I (not an admin) like the new picture better (it shows the Doctor's distinctive hairstyle better and there is no mood lighting), but it will probably have to be cropped a bit. [[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:32, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


Eleventh Doctor to Sarah Jane Smith: "Come along, Smith!" ([[Death of the Doctor (TV story)|Source]]) [[User:MrSiriusBlack|MrSiriusBlack]] [[User talk:MrSiriusBlack|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:44, August 1, 2013 (UTC)
:: Yes — discussion ''is'' needed before anybody (even an admin) can change the infobox image of one of the TV Doctors. But I think in this case it is a discussion worth having. The current image runs contrary to [[T:GTI]]'s best practices, which advise one to avoid overly stark/unnatural lighting. King's proposal is much better, but does need to be cropped severely.


== "Redeemed" ==
:: I've created a gallery presenting two potential crops. Although the tightest is the one that policy would recommend by ''default'', I think it's worth discussing, in a special case like the [[Eleventh Doctor]], whether it's worth settling for the slightly wider (but still ''acceptable'') crop of #3, which allows us to see a bit of the iconic [[bow tie]].


Per [[T:NPOV]], we're not really supposed to say a character has turned good or been redeemed. Can someone familiar with [[The Collector (DWA comic story)|''The Collector'' (DWA comic story)]] make the section more neutral? -- [[User:Tybort|Tybort]] ([[User talk:Tybort|talk page]]) 10:06, May 25, 2013 (UTC)
:: Thoughts? [[User:Scrooge MacDuck|Scrooge MacDuck]] [[User talk:Scrooge MacDuck|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:44, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


==New Image for Series 7 Part 2 2013==
::: I agree. Image #3 seems like the more preferable option. [[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:51, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


As all of you are aware, Matt Smith had a costume change, trading in his tweed jacket for a long coat and waistcoat. To this end, i believe the current image is obsolete and should be traded for a picture of him in Series 7 Part 2. Discuss this and do make suggestions for a new image. Thanks! [[User:Lord Castabarus|Lord Castabarus]] [[User talk:Lord Castabarus|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:55, September 28, 2013 (UTC)
:::: Same. I like the cropped one with the bow tie. [[User:King of the Sandmen|King of the Sandmen]] [[User talk:King of the Sandmen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 14:53, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


::::: Good, good! That being said, I don't want this to be just a choice between the overly contrasted current image and the ''[[Closing Time (TV story)|Closing Time]]'' one. It's not often we change a TV Doctor's infobox image, so I figured I'd put a few more options on the table. I've added four new images. Where possible I've done the same thing of cropping them widely enough to retain the bowtie, but of course, any of those could be cropped more tightly if we want. Personally I'd be partial to #8, which I think best embodies the "spirit" of the Eleventh Doctor, and has a nice contrast between the face and the background. But any of those would, I think, be acceptable, and all of them would be superior to the current image. [[User:Scrooge MacDuck|Scrooge MacDuck]] [[User talk:Scrooge MacDuck|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 15:08, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


  All images for seasons 5-7.1 should be his original costume,
:::::: While I also like #8, I think it might be a bit ''too'' goofy (particularly 11's eyes). I'd say #7 would be my pick, as I think it sums up 11 throughout his tenure best. [[User:King of the Sandmen|King of the Sandmen]] [[User talk:King of the Sandmen|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 15:21, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
  because that's what he wore.
  Images for season 7.2 should be his updated outfit.
    [[User:Masterpwn|Masterpwn]] [[User talk:Masterpwn|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:15, April 7, 2014 (UTC)


== Removed section ==
::::::: I personally like #8 most as it has a clear view of his face, a close crop, good lighting and shows the [[bow tie]]. My second choice would be #5 which has a clear view of his face, a close crop, good lighting and (in my opinion) better hair. However, #5 doesn't show the bowtie. It's also not from a standard episode which, while fine by me, may be confusing to newer users wondering where the image is from. I'm also quite partial to #6 as it shows the fez although this does hide his hair. [[User:Bongolium500|Bongo50 (aka Bongolium500)]] [[User talk:Bongolium500|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 15:31, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
When I encountered it, the page had the following in the BTS section. It's largely unremarkable, because across all media, almost every incarnation has interacted with a younger version of himself.  Also, it was a bit weird to have this in the BTS section, since it would have been better placed in the main, in-universe part of the article. If it were notable.  Which it really isn't.  


It's also not at all unusual for any incarnation to meet his ''duplicates''.  It's been happening since ''[[The Chase (TV story)|The Chase]]'' in 1965. 


I'm therefore placing the info here as a sort of archive, but the info probably shouldn't go back into the article unless substantially refactored. Some of this information might be appropriate for the [[Doppelgänger]] article. Or, if someone got really ambitious, it might be incorporated into a couple of charts: one listing all the times the Doctor has met a different version of the same regeneration, and another listing all instances of the Doctor's doubles. {{user:CzechOut/Sig}}{{User:CzechOut/TimeFormat}} 17:31: Wed 27 Nov 2013</span>
::::::: 5>7>8>6>4/3 Number 8 is lovely, but it's from Series 5 and his hair and hwatnot don't really cement themselves until the beginning of Series 6. #5 gives us a good compromise in terms of look, he's got his Series 6-7A outfit on (which is a perfected version of Series 5's outfit) and his hair is the lok he has from Series 6 forward. [[User:NoNotTheMemes|NoNotTheMemes]] [[User talk:NoNotTheMemes|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 17:06, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
<div id=box>
=== Meeting himself ===
While different incarnations of the Doctor have interacted in the past, the Eleventh Doctor is notable for interacting directly with the ''same incarnation'' from different points in time, despite the violation of the [[First Law of Time]], on at least four occasions:


* Just prior to his resetting of the universe, when he encountered a version of himself, apparently mortally wounded, from a few minutes into his future. His future self whispered something into this past self's ear before "expiring" (although this was ultimately a ruse). ([[TV]]: ''[[The Big Bang (TV story)|The Big Bang]]'')
:::::::: I still like #3, but #7 is also pretty good. I don't really like #6, purely because it hides his hair and exaggerates his forehead, and while #5 is good, it seems a little blurry.[[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 02:26, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
* During a bizarre incident in which the TARDIS materialised inside itself and the Doctor exploited time paradox created by this in order to tell himself how to resolve the situation. ([[TV]]: ''[[Time (TV story)|Time]]'')
* During an accidental crossing of the time streams when the Doctor encountered a future version of himself as he was about to share one final adventure with River Song before [[Forest of the Dead (TV story)|she met her final fate]], during which they had a brief conversation about his (and her) future. ([[HOMEVID]]: ''[[Last Night (TV story)|Last Night]]'')
* In order to stop the destruction of the TARDIS, the Doctor travels back in time to the beginning of the adventure through a [[time rift]] and instructs his past self on what to do before disappearing. This completely erases the events that had followed and led up to this meeting, though the Doctor retained his memory of the erased timeline, and Clara began to remember details later. ([[TV]]: ''[[Journey to the Centre of the TARDIS (TV story)|Journey to the Centre of the TARDIS]]'', ''[[The Name of the Doctor (TV story)|The Name of the Doctor]]'')


Although the Doctor has previously encountered or viewed his current incarnation from different points in the time stream ([[TV]]: ''[[Day of the Daleks]]'', ''[[Father's Day (TV story)|Father's Day]]''), the Eleventh Doctor's encounters with himself were more substantial in nature, on three occasions contributing to the resolution of a dilemma, and the third involving discussion about a major event in the Doctor's life.
I just need to point out that '''none''' of these images are cropped enough, with the exception of the current page image (and maybe #4). Please see our guidelines at [[Tardis:Guide to images]] for what we're looking for in an infobox image before posting any more choices thanks. [[User:Shambala108|Shambala108]] [[User talk:Shambala108|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 03:04, 8 May 2021 (UTC)


This incarnation of the Doctor has also had numerous copies or duplicates of him made, for which he's seen for himself. These are:
: I reckon we could probably crop #7 and #8 a bit more and they would still be okay. Though we would unfortunately lose the bowtie. [[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 03:09, 8 May 2021 (UTC)


*[[Prisoner Zero]] taking his appearance with a young [[Amelia Pond]] from Amy's consciousness while she was asleep. ([[TV]]: ''[[The Eleventh Hour (TV story)|The Eleventh Hour]]'')
: I've added two cropped images to the gallery. Are they acceptable? Though I couldn't find any option to add a copyright licence when adding them to the gallery, so they may need to be reuploaded with the applicable "BBC screenshot" licence. [[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 03:24, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
*The ''Teselecta'' who posed as the Doctor to avoid his death, as it replaced him at [[Lake Silencio]] while being shot by [[River Song]] as part of [[Madame Kovarian]]'s plan to kill the Doctor. ([[TV]]: ''[[The Impossible Astronaut (TV story)|The Impossible Astronaut]]'', ''[[The Wedding of River Song (TV story)]]'')
*A doppelganger (or [[Ganger]]) version that was created when the Doctor activated the [[sonic screwdriver]] on a container of living [[The Flesh|Flesh]]. This died whilst killing a mutated version of the Ganger of [[Jennifer Lucas]]. ([[TV]]: ''[[The Rebel Flesh (TV story)|The Rebel Flesh]]'' / ''[[The Almost People (TV story)|The Almost People]]'')
: {{Main|Eleventh Doctor (Ganger)}}
*A [[Spoonhead]] version of him that was made by [[Kizlet]] to upload [[Clara Oswald]] to the [[Wi-Fi]] for the [[Great Intelligence]] to feast on. ([[TV]]: ''[[The Bells of Saint John (TV story)|The Bells of Saint John]]'')
*A [[Cyber-Planner]] that invaded the Doctor's mind, calling himself "[[Mr Clever]]". ([[TV]]: ''[[Nightmare in Silver (TV story)|Nightmare in Silver]]'')
</div>


== Editing article for posterity ==
:: @[[User:Shambala108|Shambala108]]: please read the discussion. I'm aware that some of the images ''could'' be closer-cropped. However, I have made the executive admin decision that the '''overwhelming and obvious need''' to include the [[bow tie]] in an image meant to represent the whole of the [[Eleventh Doctor]] may warrant this small exception to our rules, '''assuming''' the community can build a consensus around it.
Now that the Smith era is done, it's time to sorta refactor this article "for posterity".


So while it's sort of natural that this page has attracted a lot of images from the two most recent episodes, please try to remember these are just '''two''' chapters from an entire book of adventures.  A lot of these images have now been removed.  Remember that we need to give balance with other media.  While there are '''some''' images from comics, for instance, we've got nothing from the Clara era in comics, nor do we have a lot from ''[[Doctor Who Adventures]]''.
:: @[[User:LauraBatham]]: it is imperative that images have licenses upon upload. I have gone back and added them, which, for the record, can always be done ''after'' the fact by going to the file's page and editing the description manually. [[User:Scrooge MacDuck|Scrooge MacDuck]] [[User talk:Scrooge MacDuck|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 07:38, 8 May 2021 (UTC)


This is the biggest article on the entire wiki — '''''by far''''' — and yet it's in many ways quite incomplete. This is because — again, quite naturally — a lot of editors have added a lot of information about ''Name'', ''Day'' and ''Time of the Doctor''. This all needs editing back, and more information needs to slide in from the later books and comics of this era.  {{user:CzechOut/Sig}}{{User:CzechOut/TimeFormat}} 05:43: Sun 05 Jan 2014</span>
::: Thanks for that Scrooge. I did think of adding it after, but I couldn't see how to do it. Now, looking at what you've done, I can see that there is a screenshot template that I was previously unaware of. [[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 08:26, 8 May 2021 (UTC)


== Infobox Image and T:GTI ==
::: I've added another option (and this time added the licence) which I think manages to show enough of the hair and the bow tie while (hopefully) still being cropped enough. [[User:LauraBatham|LauraBatham]] [[User talk:LauraBatham|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 08:57, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
:::: Indeed, very attractive proposal. I want to be clear that while I think an exception to the "''very'' tight cropping" rule for the bowtie's sake would be ''acceptable'', an option that manages to still crop closely ''while'' showing the bowtie woule be better. [[User:Scrooge MacDuck|Scrooge MacDuck]] [[User talk:Scrooge MacDuck|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 15:16, 8 May 2021 (UTC)


I don't get how a badly lit photo in which only half of the character's face is visible in anyway complies to T:GTI. If it does then I recommend a rewrite of the policy, because ElevenInShadowsTDODT.jpg is a '''really''' bad image. Please replace it? [[Special:Contributions/90.204.74.187|90.204.74.187]]<sup>[[User talk:90.204.74.187#top|talk to me]]</sup> 14:57, March 9, 2014 (UTC)
=== Minor revisit ===
[[File:Eleventh_Doctor_The_Power_of_Three B.JPG|thumb|A looser crop.]]
Following the changes to [[T:GTI]], etc, can I suggest the same image as before, but less tightly cropped? This image also contains Eleven's hair and bowtie which are important. {{User:Epsilon the Eternal/signature}} 00:01, 19 September 2023 (UTC)


== Speculation in this one part of the article ==
: Agreed. I'm in favour of this change. [[User:BlueSupergiant|BlueSupergiant]] [[User talk:BlueSupergiant|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 00:16, 19 September 2023 (UTC)


"...and Clara later admitted she fancied him while under the influence of a Truth Field..."
:: Yes please! [[Special:Contributions/68.33.189.71|68.33.189.71]]<sup>[[User talk:68.33.189.71#top|talk to me]]</sup> 00:51, 19 September 2023 (UTC)


This isn't actually true, she never completed the sentence. She could've been saying that she fancied travel through space and time, seeing distant planets, or the Doctor. It's implied that she fancied ''him'', but never confirmed because she never completes the sentence. [[User:Masterpwn|Masterpwn]] [[User talk:Masterpwn|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 13:16, April 7, 2014 (UTC)
::: Doing this is essentially just following [[T:BOUND]] in my opinion, given the January debate about this. [[User:OttselSpy25|OS25]][[User Talk:OttselSpy25|🤙☎️]] 01:02, 19 September 2023 (UTC)


==Image==
:::: Agree with the new image. We ought to be able to see the bow tie and hair properly. [[User:Aquanafrahudy|<span style="font-family: serif; color: pink" title="Hallo." > Aquanafrahudy</span>]] [[User talk: Aquanafrahudy|<span title="Talk to me">📢</span>]]  06:55, 19 September 2023 (UTC)


At 14:57, March 9, 2014, [[User: 90.204.74.187|90.204.74.187]] wrote: "I don't get how a badly lit photo in which only half of the character's face is visible in anyway complies to T:GTI. If it does then I recommend a rewrite of the policy, because ElevenInShadowsTDODT.jpg is a really bad image. Please replace it?".
::::: Nothing to add really, seems in-line with consensus, and I do believe I agree with it. [[User:Cookieboy 2005|Cookieboy 2005]] [[User talk:Cookieboy 2005|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 10:48, 19 September 2023 (UTC)


I agree. Pretty much 85% of the image is complete blackness and only half of [[Matt Smith|Matt]]'s face is visible, literally. I suggest we discuss new images for the infobox, with the current one out of the question. I tried to revert the image back to the pre-November 2013 one, but this was strongly contested by [[User:Tybort|Tybort]] and a slight breach of [[T:NO WARS|the edit war policy]] from [[User:Shambala108|Shambala]]. OK, this is me 'taking the matter into the discussion page'. [[User:OfficialBBC|OfficialBBC]] [[User talk:OfficialBBC|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 19:13, April 17, 2014 (UTC)
: Since there appears to be consensus for this change, I've updated the article. This proposal is essentially the same image anyway so I don't think there's much more discussion to be had. [[User:BlueSupergiant|BlueSupergiant]] [[User talk:BlueSupergiant|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 23:37, 21 September 2023 (UTC)
 
This issue seems to have been going on for a while so I'm going to add it on the page, and if they take it off, alas, hopefully it'll change eventually. I posted it below in the second image change notice.
 
==CURRENT Image change Discussion - Does anyone want it?==
The image that is being used is poorly lit, only focuses on his face and has 1/4th of the image with just a black background.[[User:BananaClownMan|BananaClownMan]] [[User talk:BananaClownMan|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 18:37, January 5, 2015 (UTC)
 
:Hi, I completely agree. I have a much better image that I would like to upload if there are no disagreements. Its better light and full face. [[File:Eleventh_Bells_St_John.jpg|thumb]] .[[User:Harry Flynn]]
 
::Harry Flynn, please note that for popular pages, we must have community consensus before changing infobox images. Your image has been removed and the previous one added back. Before you propose any infobox images for consideration, please read through all our image policies, which are conveniently located at [[Thread:148148]]. The image you've posted here will not be chosen because it is not tightly cropped enough. Thanks! [[User:Shambala108|Shambala108]] [[User talk:Shambala108|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 22:00, November 12, 2015 (UTC)
 
I have cropped the image and will post it here. It is attached to this particular topic so check it out if you would like! So, does anyone want to change it and if so, is there any consensus for this image? (Also, is this correctly cropped?) [[User:Harry Flynn|Flynn]] [[User talk:Harry Flynn|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 17:34, November 14, 2015 (UTC)Harry Flynn[[User:Harry Flynn|Flynn]] [[User talk:Harry Flynn|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 17:34, November 14, 2015 (UTC)
 
:I suggest you read [[Tardis:Guide to images]] '''and''' browse some Doctor and companion pages so you'll know exactly what we're looking for in an infobox image. Thanks! [[User:Shambala108|Shambala108]] [[User talk:Shambala108|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 19:11, November 14, 2015 (UTC)
 
== Eleven gone?? ==
 
Erm is it my computer or has the profile for the Eleventh Doctor vanished? [[User:Valeyard12.5|Valeyard12.5]] [[User talk:Valeyard12.5|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 21:06, September 13, 2015 (UTC)
:Hi, Valeyard12.5. I can still see Eleven's profile on my computer, but I'm really glad you brought up this issue because that tells me it's not my individual computer. This happened to me earlier when I edited [[Prime Minister of the United Kingdom]]. After I added new short story information, the page went blank and remained blank when I reloaded it. I reverted the edit and added the information again and the page appeared normally. Later I went to add an image to ''[[The Singular Case of the Time Machine (short story)|The Singular Case of the Time Machine]]'' and the page was blank, even though the last time I edited it, it was fine. In both situations when I clicked on the pages to edit them, all the information was still intact, it was just showing a blank page on the actual page. After I added the image and published it, ''The Singular case of the Time Machine'' page was no longer blank. I have no idea what's going on, but it appears to be some kind of site glitch that I've never experienced on this (or any wiki) before. [[User:Mewiet|Mewiet]] [[User talk:Mewiet|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 21:18, September 13, 2015 (UTC)
::I've experienced it too, and I've wondered what might be causing it. It's good to know I'm not the only one who's encountered this. *Whew!* --[[User:Bold Clone|<span style="color:darkblue">'''Bold'''</span>]] [[User Talk:Bold Clone|<span style="color:gold">'''Clone'''</span>]] 22:12, September 13, 2015 (UTC)
 
Not sure if this is the same thing you guys are talking about, but sometimes you can run across a page that looks like it's blank (but it really isn't if you look at it in source mode). Just hit edit and publish, and the content will be restored. If the problem is something different, you might want to bring it up at [[Board:The Drax Cave]]. [[User:Shambala108|Shambala108]] [[User talk:Shambala108|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 03:35, September 15, 2015 (UTC)
 
== Infobox image ==
Having reached a general consensus on a new image for the [[Twelfth Doctor]], I've gaged from the comments of other users that the current infobox image used for the [[Eleventh Doctor]] should perhaps be changed to one better befitting his personality. We should probably have a break before starting the process of searching for a new image, as we have only just reached conclusion on the Twelfth Doctor. I just wanted to see what everybody else thought before jumping into anything. [[User:66 Seconds|66 Seconds]] [[User talk:66 Seconds|<span title="Talk to me">☎</span>]] 23:52, August 13, 2017 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 00:53, 13 March 2024

Archive.png
 Archives: #1, #2, #3, #4, #5

Main Image Change[[edit source]]

I want to change the main image for the Eleventh Doctor's page. Can I do that? I've uploaded the image that I would use. King of the Sandmen ☎ 14:25, 7 May 2021 (UTC)

There has to be a discussion first with big pages like this, and an admin has to give a final ruling. I (not an admin) like the new picture better (it shows the Doctor's distinctive hairstyle better and there is no mood lighting), but it will probably have to be cropped a bit. LauraBatham ☎ 14:32, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
Yes — discussion is needed before anybody (even an admin) can change the infobox image of one of the TV Doctors. But I think in this case it is a discussion worth having. The current image runs contrary to T:GTI's best practices, which advise one to avoid overly stark/unnatural lighting. King's proposal is much better, but does need to be cropped severely.
I've created a gallery presenting two potential crops. Although the tightest is the one that policy would recommend by default, I think it's worth discussing, in a special case like the Eleventh Doctor, whether it's worth settling for the slightly wider (but still acceptable) crop of #3, which allows us to see a bit of the iconic bow tie.
Thoughts? Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 14:44, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
I agree. Image #3 seems like the more preferable option. LauraBatham ☎ 14:51, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
Same. I like the cropped one with the bow tie. King of the Sandmen ☎ 14:53, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
Good, good! That being said, I don't want this to be just a choice between the overly contrasted current image and the Closing Time one. It's not often we change a TV Doctor's infobox image, so I figured I'd put a few more options on the table. I've added four new images. Where possible I've done the same thing of cropping them widely enough to retain the bowtie, but of course, any of those could be cropped more tightly if we want. Personally I'd be partial to #8, which I think best embodies the "spirit" of the Eleventh Doctor, and has a nice contrast between the face and the background. But any of those would, I think, be acceptable, and all of them would be superior to the current image. Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 15:08, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
While I also like #8, I think it might be a bit too goofy (particularly 11's eyes). I'd say #7 would be my pick, as I think it sums up 11 throughout his tenure best. King of the Sandmen ☎ 15:21, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
I personally like #8 most as it has a clear view of his face, a close crop, good lighting and shows the bow tie. My second choice would be #5 which has a clear view of his face, a close crop, good lighting and (in my opinion) better hair. However, #5 doesn't show the bowtie. It's also not from a standard episode which, while fine by me, may be confusing to newer users wondering where the image is from. I'm also quite partial to #6 as it shows the fez although this does hide his hair. Bongo50 (aka Bongolium500) ☎ 15:31, 7 May 2021 (UTC)


5>7>8>6>4/3 Number 8 is lovely, but it's from Series 5 and his hair and hwatnot don't really cement themselves until the beginning of Series 6. #5 gives us a good compromise in terms of look, he's got his Series 6-7A outfit on (which is a perfected version of Series 5's outfit) and his hair is the lok he has from Series 6 forward. NoNotTheMemes ☎ 17:06, 7 May 2021 (UTC)
I still like #3, but #7 is also pretty good. I don't really like #6, purely because it hides his hair and exaggerates his forehead, and while #5 is good, it seems a little blurry.LauraBatham ☎ 02:26, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

I just need to point out that none of these images are cropped enough, with the exception of the current page image (and maybe #4). Please see our guidelines at Tardis:Guide to images for what we're looking for in an infobox image before posting any more choices thanks. Shambala108 ☎ 03:04, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

I reckon we could probably crop #7 and #8 a bit more and they would still be okay. Though we would unfortunately lose the bowtie. LauraBatham ☎ 03:09, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
I've added two cropped images to the gallery. Are they acceptable? Though I couldn't find any option to add a copyright licence when adding them to the gallery, so they may need to be reuploaded with the applicable "BBC screenshot" licence. LauraBatham ☎ 03:24, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
@Shambala108: please read the discussion. I'm aware that some of the images could be closer-cropped. However, I have made the executive admin decision that the overwhelming and obvious need to include the bow tie in an image meant to represent the whole of the Eleventh Doctor may warrant this small exception to our rules, assuming the community can build a consensus around it.
@User:LauraBatham: it is imperative that images have licenses upon upload. I have gone back and added them, which, for the record, can always be done after the fact by going to the file's page and editing the description manually. Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 07:38, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
Thanks for that Scrooge. I did think of adding it after, but I couldn't see how to do it. Now, looking at what you've done, I can see that there is a screenshot template that I was previously unaware of. LauraBatham ☎ 08:26, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
I've added another option (and this time added the licence) which I think manages to show enough of the hair and the bow tie while (hopefully) still being cropped enough. LauraBatham ☎ 08:57, 8 May 2021 (UTC)
Indeed, very attractive proposal. I want to be clear that while I think an exception to the "very tight cropping" rule for the bowtie's sake would be acceptable, an option that manages to still crop closely while showing the bowtie woule be better. Scrooge MacDuck ☎ 15:16, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

Minor revisit[[edit source]]

A looser crop.

Following the changes to T:GTI, etc, can I suggest the same image as before, but less tightly cropped? This image also contains Eleven's hair and bowtie which are important.

00:01, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

Agreed. I'm in favour of this change. BlueSupergiant ☎ 00:16, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
Yes please! 68.33.189.71talk to me 00:51, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
Doing this is essentially just following T:BOUND in my opinion, given the January debate about this. OS25🤙☎️ 01:02, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
Agree with the new image. We ought to be able to see the bow tie and hair properly. Aquanafrahudy 📢 06:55, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
Nothing to add really, seems in-line with consensus, and I do believe I agree with it. Cookieboy 2005 ☎ 10:48, 19 September 2023 (UTC)
Since there appears to be consensus for this change, I've updated the article. This proposal is essentially the same image anyway so I don't think there's much more discussion to be had. BlueSupergiant ☎ 23:37, 21 September 2023 (UTC)
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